Random Penguins Fodder

[Skatingpen]

POJ joining his brother in St.Louis. Good luck to him.

1 year $950K.

Pens must not have been impressed to not bring him back. Or they are very high on Gryzzz

He was always disrespected here

[DelPen]

Thinking about Sid’s next contract, is there any negative for going 8 years, $50 million from the Pens side? It’s essentially 5 years, $10 million for what I expect him to actually play but could see him go to the full 8 if he wanted to and is able because he’s that driven.

But this lowers his cap hit now, assuming he retires with a few years left we aren’t going to need that cap space and it would even help get us to the floor. Even doing 8 x $8.7 again isn’t crazy. Once Sid retires this team is going to be full rebuild and bad so again, a cap hit will not matter in 6 years if it gets a better AAV now.

I guess the question is if Sid would want to do that? Structuring as much front loaded as possible under the CBA of course.

[Crash66]

All I can think of is "Why Pinto?". Belushi belches. "Why not?"

[KG]

Thinking about Sid’s next contract, is there any negative for going 8 years, $50 million from the Pens side? It’s essentially 5 years, $10 million for what I expect him to actually play but could see him go to the full 8 if he wanted to and is able because he’s that driven.

But this lowers his cap hit now, assuming he retires with a few years left we aren’t going to need that cap space and it would even help get us to the floor. Even doing 8 x $8.7 again isn’t crazy. Once Sid retires this team is going to be full rebuild and bad so again, a cap hit will not matter in 6 years if it gets a better AAV now.

I guess the question is if Sid would want to do that? Structuring as much front loaded as possible under the CBA of course.

I haven't thought much about Sid's contract to be honest. I do think it's a little strange that all parties want it to be such a secret. I mean, it's a negotiation. How much do you want ? and do you want to stay here? Hopefully Sid signs for 3+ years and not 1 year at a time.

[Dynasty1970]

Thinking about Sid’s next contract, is there any negative for going 8 years, $50 million from the Pens side? It’s essentially 5 years, $10 million for what I expect him to actually play but could see him go to the full 8 if he wanted to and is able because he’s that driven.

But this lowers his cap hit now, assuming he retires with a few years left we aren’t going to need that cap space and it would even help get us to the floor. Even doing 8 x $8.7 again isn’t crazy. Once Sid retires this team is going to be full rebuild and bad so again, a cap hit will not matter in 6 years if it gets a better AAV now.

I guess the question is if Sid would want to do that? Structuring as much front loaded as possible under the CBA of course.

Going with the Bobby Bonilla contract ehh?

[Dynasty1970]

I know I'm in the small minority here, but I really think Graves can pull out of this. He has a stable and good NHL career to this point. Sometimes, when you are trying to justify your contract, things can get away from you. Gonchar, especially Martin, had a tough go of it in their first year here. I'm certainly pulling for him to rebound.

Oh he'll pull out of this.....With another team, With a different HC.

[Pens4Life]

Gonchar and Martin had bad first years here as well, thats true..but not that bad as Graves!? If he stays,lets hope he bounces back..

Crosby deal - 3yrs 21M, thats about it,then he retires..

[FLPensFan]

On the topic of our defensive depth:

Right defense:
-Letang, Karlsson, St. Ivany
-Pettersson, Graves, Grzelcyk, Aho, Ludvig*, Shea*, Kral, Pickering, Belliveau, Clurman, Hollowell

11 deep on the left side, 3 deep on the right side, with the understanding that Ludvig and Shea were both trusted to play RD last season. They could definitely use another true RD or 2.

I think Dubas likely made a fair offer (I don't believe the rumor they were 750k apart). I think the Penguins were likely in the 800-900k range. Maybe POJ knew that there was a chance his brother was going to be moved, and knew he had a chance to play somewhere with him. Either way, POJ was very up and down in his time here. He had good showings and bad, and it never really went season to season with him. It was more like 20 games of good, 20 games of bad or underwhelming play.

[Gunnerfan]

Gonchar and Martin had bad first years here as well, thats true..but not that bad as Graves!? If he stays,lets hope he bounces back..

Crosby deal - 3yrs 21M, thats about it,then he retires..

True, but don’t ignore the fact that he did have a good career up until this point.

[KG]

[DelPen]

Jack Johnson back in Columbus for minimum, his cap hit is worse for use than them. Awesome.

[100565]

As a less than 35+ UFA, Stamkos just got 4x$8mil.

Crosby is the better player but he is 35+.

I think fair deal is 3x$8.7mil AAV - front loaded a bit.

[Pitts]

POJ joining his brother in St.Louis. Good luck to him.

1 year $950K.

Pens must not have been impressed to not bring him back. Or they are very high on Gryzzz

Yohe has stated several times over the last season, and as recently as 2 days ago that despite his good play at the end of the season, they have never been happy with his development.

[Pens4Life]

On the topic of our defensive depth:

Right defense:
-Letang, Karlsson, St. Ivany
-Pettersson, Graves, Grzelcyk, Aho, Ludvig*, Shea*, Kral, Pickering, Belliveau, Clurman, Hollowell

11 deep on the left side, 3 deep on the right side, with the understanding that Ludvig and Shea were both trusted to play RD last season. They could definitely use another true RD or 2.

Clurman and Hollowell are RHD per CapFriendly, I hope drafted rookies Brunicke and Pietila both RHD will play in WBS upcoming season. I'm not sure for Vaisanen and Harding.

So with all drafted guys included we actually have - 9 RHD and 9 LHD :

RHD - Letang, Karlsson, St'Ivany, Brunicke, Pietila, Clurman, Hollowell, Vaisanen, Harding
LHD - Pettersson, Graves, Grzelcyk, Aho, Shea, Ludvig, Kral, Pickering, Belliveau

[pfim]

POJ joining his brother in St.Louis. Good luck to him.

1 year $950K.

Pens must not have been impressed to not bring him back. Or they are very high on Gryzzz

Yohe has stated several times over the last season, and as recently as 2 days ago that despite his good play at the end of the season, they have never been happy with his development.

He's 25 and has played at a reasonable level consistently for about 1/3 of a season. Still, hard to believe 950k wasn't in the cards given they just gave the Bruins' worst defenseman 2.75 million.

[DeHaven162]

POJ joining his brother in St.Louis. Good luck to him.

1 year $950K.

Pens must not have been impressed to not bring him back. Or they are very high on Gryzzz

Yohe has stated several times over the last season, and as recently as 2 days ago that despite his good play at the end of the season, they have never been happy with his development.

He's 25 and has played at a reasonable level consistently for about 1/3 of a season. Still, hard to believe 950k wasn't in the cards given they just gave the Bruins' worst defenseman 2.75 million.

I think we're missing the meaning of Dubas' stated goal for this FA period. He clearly stated he wants to start gaining younger future assets. POJ is not that. He's a guy who's been here a while, and done nothing with it. He has flashes, sure, but he's nothing more than a fringe guy. Just because he's young doesn't mean he's valuable. He clearly didn't have much of a market or demand.

Just because Dubas wants to get younger, doesn't mean he shouldn't sign 30+ guys. Everyone harps on Gryz being 30 and having a bad year and scratched in the playoffs. But forget just one season before, he was playing on Boston's top pair, was a +46 on the best regular season team in NHL history. Who has a better chance of getting you a legit future asset, AKA trading at the deadline if this season is a struggle: POJ or a rebound Gryz? Give me Gryz all day.

Getting "younger" on July 1 doesn't happen. Guys who are young are typically cast offs who didn't get a QO for a reason. I have no problem signing guys like Gryz to a 1 year deal that could be flipable at the deadline.

[KG]

POJ joining his brother in St.Louis. Good luck to him.

1 year $950K.

Pens must not have been impressed to not bring him back. Or they are very high on Gryzzz

Yohe has stated several times over the last season, and as recently as 2 days ago that despite his good play at the end of the season, they have never been happy with his development.

He's 25 and has played at a reasonable level consistently for about 1/3 of a season. Still, hard to believe 950k wasn't in the cards given they just gave the Bruins' worst defenseman 2.75 million.

I think we're missing the meaning of Dubas' stated goal for this FA period. He clearly stated he wants to start gaining younger future assets. POJ is not that. He's a guy who's been here a while, and done nothing with it. He has flashes, sure, but he's nothing more than a fringe guy. Just because he's young doesn't mean he's valuable. He clearly didn't have much of a market or demand.

Just because Dubas wants to get younger, doesn't mean he shouldn't sign 30+ guys. Everyone harps on Gryz being 30 and having a bad year and scratched in the playoffs. But forget just one season before, he was playing on Boston's top pair, was a +46 on the best regular season team in NHL history. Who has a better chance of getting you a legit future asset, AKA trading at the deadline if this season is a struggle: POJ or a rebound Gryz? Give me Gryz all day.

Getting "younger" on July 1 doesn't happen. Guys who are young are typically cast offs who didn't get a QO for a reason. I have no problem signing guys like Gryz to a 1 year deal that could be flipable at the deadline.

Good point DeH. The ceiling is much higher with Gryz returning to form than POJ ever coming close to that level here. We are looking for more mobility on the backend and Gryz provides that. I'm looking forward to seeing how he does here with his old college coach Quinn.

[KG]

Little quiet as free agency goes on. Assuming the rumors are true that we have an offer out to Tarasenko that means we are looking for a top 6 forward. Not many options left besides him in free agency. Sprong (nope), Roslovic, he's a 3rd line player.

If we miss out on Tarasenko, then we will have to go the trade route. What top 6 forwards are rumored to be available? Some we would have to pay assets to acquire, others we would get paid to take.

Laine, E. Kane, Ehlers, Vatrano, Kuzmenko, Fabbri (meh), Gallagher & Anderson in Montreal both rough contracts, Anders Lee, Saad, Sheary (nope).

Not a ton out there. Laine makes a lot of sense when he's out of the program. We would off-load a contract or 2 to make the money a little closer too. Could be a low risk, high reward situation and he's under contract for 2 seasons which fits in line to what we are doing.

Curious to see who we add. I just hope we add 1 more impact forward this summer.

[DeHaven162]

Little quiet as free agency goes on. Assuming the rumors are true that we have an offer out to Tarasenko that means we are looking for a top 6 forward. Not many options left besides him in free agency. Sprong (nope), Roslovic, he's a 3rd line player.

If we miss out on Tarasenko, then we will have to go the trade route. What top 6 forwards are rumored to be available? Some we would have to pay assets to acquire, others we would get paid to take.

Laine, E. Kane, Ehlers, Vatrano, Kuzmenko, Fabbri (meh), Gallagher & Anderson in Montreal both rough contracts, Anders Lee, Saad, Sheary (nope).

Not a ton out there. Laine makes a lot of sense when he's out of the program. We would off-load a contract or 2 to make the money a little closer too. Could be a low risk, high reward situation and he's under contract for 2 seasons which fits in line to what we are doing.

Curious to see who we add. I just hope we add 1 more impact forward this summer.

And for as meh as July 1 seemed for the Pens, I honestly think we're a bit deeper than last year. Bottom 6 of DOC - Hayes - Beavillier / Lizotte - Eller - Acciari has to feel better than Harkins and Zohorna around. If they can find one of those top 6 wingers to play and allow DOC to slide to L3, I'd take that all day. A big factor will be Geno's play and needing a BIG bounceback from Rakell.

[FLPensFan]

On the topic of our defensive depth:

Right defense:
-Letang, Karlsson, St. Ivany
-Pettersson, Graves, Grzelcyk, Aho, Ludvig*, Shea*, Kral, Pickering, Belliveau, Clurman, Hollowell

11 deep on the left side, 3 deep on the right side, with the understanding that Ludvig and Shea were both trusted to play RD last season. They could definitely use another true RD or 2.

Clurman and Hollowell are RHD per CapFriendly, I hope drafted rookies Brunicke and Pietila both RHD will play in WBS upcoming season. I'm not sure for Vaisanen and Harding.

So with all drafted guys included we actually have - 9 RHD and 9 LHD :

RHD - Letang, Karlsson, St'Ivany, Brunicke, Pietila, Clurman, Hollowell, Vaisanen, Harding
LHD - Pettersson, Graves, Grzelcyk, Aho, Shea, Ludvig, Kral, Pickering, Belliveau

Thanks for the update on Clurman and Hollowell. Must have mixed those up. Pietila is 20 so he could conceivably play in WBS, but, my gut says he is returning to Michigan Tech. Brunicke is only 18, so he cannot play in WBS.

I also forgot Emil Pieniniemi playing over Finland. 2023 3rd rounder is a left defenseman. So, looks like we are pretty well balanced.

[KG]

If Toronto doesn't have a "do not trade with Dubas policy", Nick Roberton would certainly be a target for us. Young, goal scorer, small!, former Dubas pick. He's requested a trade.

[lemieuxReturns]

Little quiet as free agency goes on. Assuming the rumors are true that we have an offer out to Tarasenko that means we are looking for a top 6 forward. Not many options left besides him in free agency. Sprong (nope), Roslovic, he's a 3rd line player.

If we miss out on Tarasenko, then we will have to go the trade route. What top 6 forwards are rumored to be available? Some we would have to pay assets to acquire, others we would get paid to take.

Laine, E. Kane, Ehlers, Vatrano, Kuzmenko, Fabbri (meh), Gallagher & Anderson in Montreal both rough contracts, Anders Lee, Saad, Sheary (nope).

Not a ton out there. Laine makes a lot of sense when he's out of the program. We would off-load a contract or 2 to make the money a little closer too. Could be a low risk, high reward situation and he's under contract for 2 seasons which fits in line to what we are doing.

Curious to see who we add. I just hope we add 1 more impact forward this summer.

Not sure how reliable this is but...

[FLPensFan]

Using my 1980 USA Hockey Herbs Brook approach to the roster...

As the roster stands today, I see 29 players fighting for 23 spots. That's going to leave 5 guys out and being placed on waivers:

Forwards (17): Crosby, DOC, Rust, Bunting, Malkin, Rakell, Puustinen, Hayes, Beauvillier, Eller, Lizotte, Acciari, Poulin, Gruden, Bemstrom, Puljujarvi, Nieto
Defense (10): Letang, Karlsson, Pettersson, Graves, Ludvig, St. Ivany, Kral, Shea, Aho, Grzelcyk
Goalie (2): Jarry, Nedeljkovic

Nieto will definitely be on LTIR to start. Ludvig may or may not start on LTIR. (If the Penguins don't make another addition like Tarasenko, it may actually be worth it to NOT put either player on LTIR, so they can bank cap space).

At forward, I think we have Puustinen, Lizotte, Acciari, Poulin, Gruden, Bemstrom, Puljujarvi, and Nieto fighting for spots. Nieto is out, and honestly, I think even when he's ready, he gets waived to WBS. With a major knee injury and the way he's supposed to play the game, I don't think he'll be ready and effective until 2025 season. My gut says Gruden and Bemstrom are going to WBS.

On defense, I think Ludvig on LTIR or out to start, Shea and Kral to WBS.

That leaves 14F, 7D, 2G and 3.65M in cap space.

DOC-Crosby-Rust
Bunting-Malkin-Rakell
Beauvillier-Hayes-Puustinen
Lizotte-Eller-Acciari
x-Poulin, Puljujarvi

MP-Karlsson
Graves-Letang
Grzelcyk-St.Ivany
x-Aho

Jarry
Nedeljkovic

I don't see a player like Laine fitting on this team. There isn't enough cap space to absorb his 8.7. If CBJ retained 50%, the Penguins could send out a minimum salary player like Poulin or Puustinen to make the cap fit. We'd have 74K left in cap space. Just doesn't seem like it would work.

I'd look at someone like Roslovic for maybe 2.5M but then, that's going to cost someone like Puustinen a lineup spot. Where the lineup is today, any more adds up front are going to start further blocking Puustinen, Puljujarvi, Poulin, etc.

[Pitts]

POJ joining his brother in St.Louis. Good luck to him.

1 year $950K.

Pens must not have been impressed to not bring him back. Or they are very high on Gryzzz

Yohe has stated several times over the last season, and as recently as 2 days ago that despite his good play at the end of the season, they have never been happy with his development.

He's 25 and has played at a reasonable level consistently for about 1/3 of a season. Still, hard to believe 950k wasn't in the cards given they just gave the Bruins' worst defenseman 2.75 million.

As per the story line - who can figure out what their plan is??

[Pitts]

Little quiet as free agency goes on. Assuming the rumors are true that we have an offer out to Tarasenko that means we are looking for a top 6 forward. Not many options left besides him in free agency. Sprong (nope), Roslovic, he's a 3rd line player.

If we miss out on Tarasenko, then we will have to go the trade route. What top 6 forwards are rumored to be available? Some we would have to pay assets to acquire, others we would get paid to take.

Laine, E. Kane, Ehlers, Vatrano, Kuzmenko, Fabbri (meh), Gallagher & Anderson in Montreal both rough contracts, Anders Lee, Saad, Sheary (nope).

Not a ton out there. Laine makes a lot of sense when he's out of the program. We would off-load a contract or 2 to make the money a little closer too. Could be a low risk, high reward situation and he's under contract for 2 seasons which fits in line to what we are doing.

Curious to see who we add. I just hope we add 1 more impact forward this summer.

I think the single issue with Laine is, no one is allowed to talk to him while he's in the player assistance program. So, until he is released from that, there will not be any movement there.