Random Penguins Fodder

[dark_forces]

Bonino is going on waivers. 3rd time is not the charm back here.

At this point, I say no to any player over 30—period. Hextall started this insane trend. After resigning a gaggle of our over 30 players (Rakell, Rust, Malkin, Letang, etc.) he trades for or signs more over 30 players: Petry, Rutta, Granlund, etc. And, we deal/part ways with Matheson, Marino, etc.—younger players who still had upside. There's probably more, but that's my thumbnail take. Then, enter Dubas—he brings in more players well over 30, even redundant fourth liners Acciari, Nieto—which we probably could have done without, and saved cap space, by giving some younger players a chance.

[Skatingpen]

Blow it up and I mean coaches, players and get younger and some picks. This team is so far from contending, or even making the playoffs and if I can see it, I would hope the experts can as well. We already have one team happy to be .500 and out in the first round, we don’t need another.

[Sams_Dog]

Blow it up and I mean coaches, players and get younger and some picks. This team is so far from contending, or even making the playoffs and if I can see it, I would hope the experts can as well. We already have one team happy to be .500 and out in the first round, we don’t need another.

Not going to happen, bro.

[Dynasty1970]

Blow it up and I mean coaches, players and get younger and some picks. This team is so far from contending, or even making the playoffs and if I can see it, I would hope the experts can as well. We already have one team happy to be .500 and out in the first round, we don’t need another.

Not going to happen, bro.

But it needs to!

[KG]

I keep hearing many of the media, when it comes to defending Sullivan say..."you don't make a knee-jerked reaction for one bad month"...

I'm sorry, but what about last seasons disaster of missing the playoffs? Is that all Hextall's fault? Come on. What about not winning a playoff round since 2018. If it was one bad month nobody would have any issues. It's the exact opposite. It's been the same thing, same issue for years....sometimes change is good!

[FLPensFan]

I touched on this a little the other day, but there have been a series of trades over the last 2 years where, I think a lot of people on this board were looking another direction. I decided to run with some of those moves today, and not surprising, a full 23 man roster is possible making these trades instead of what Hextall/Dubas had done instead:

--Niederreiter instead of Granlund (both were traded for a 2nd, and Nino's was actually this year's 2nd, not last year)
--Bennett instead Carter (Bennett went for a 2nd and a marginal prospect)
--Chychrun instead of Karlsson (Chychrun cost a protected 1st, a 2024 2nd that can become a 1st...unlikely...and a 2026 2nd)

Even with the new contracts Niederreiter and Bennett have earned with their new teams, they still fit under the cap. Roughly 395K left with a full 23 man roster listed below:

Guentzel-Crosby-Rust
Niederreiter-Malkin-Rakell
DOC-Bennett-Smith
Harkins-Eller-Acciari
x-Puustinen, Hinostroza

MP-Letang
Graves-Chychrun
POJ-Ruhwedel
x-Ludvig

Jarry
Nedeljokovic

Chychrun, Bennett, and Niederreiter are the definition of skilled but tough to play against players that this team sorely lacks.

[dark_forces]

I touched on this a little the other day, but there have been a series of trades over the last 2 years where, I think a lot of people on this board were looking another direction. I decided to run with some of those moves today, and not surprising, a full 23 man roster is possible making these trades instead of what Hextall/Dubas had done instead:

--Niederreiter instead of Granlund (both were traded for a 2nd, and Nino's was actually this year's 2nd, not last year)
--Bennett instead Carter (Bennett went for a 2nd and a marginal prospect)
--Chychrun instead of Karlsson (Chychrun cost a protected 1st, a 2024 2nd that can become a 1st...unlikely...and a 2026 2nd)

Even with the new contracts Niederreiter and Bennett have earned with their new teams, they still fit under the cap. Roughly 395K left with a full 23 man roster listed below:

Guentzel-Crosby-Rust
Niederreiter-Malkin-Rakell
DOC-Bennett-Smith
Harkins-Eller-Acciari
x-Puustinen, Hinostroza

MP-Letang
Graves-Chychrun
POJ-Ruhwedel
x-Ludvig

Jarry
Nedeljokovic

Chychrun, Bennett, and Niederreiter are the definition of skilled but tough to play against players that this team sorely lacks.

Great analysis. I would've loved having Niedereiter on the team (plus he seemed more like a Hextall type player anyway instead of Granlund). The Carter trade looked great at the time—until he was resigned.
I honestly think Hextall made concerted attempts to land Chychrun. I think Dubas had tunnel vision when it came to Karlsson, had nearly acquired him in Toronto, knew what it would take and Karlsson is the shiny new car type of player.
One of the biggest mistakes, in my view (by Hextall) was letting both Tanev and McCann go for virtually nothing. In that instance, doing nothing at all would've only cost one of them, Still, probably Tanev.

[KG]

Ned gets the start. Smith still out.

[KG]

Bob Grove
@bobgrove91
At 13.3%, at the moment, the Pens’ PP is worst in team history. The team record for worst conversion rate in one season is 13.6% in 1967-68.

[FLPensFan]

My new theory on why Sullivan still has a job here....

The core has pulled a reverse Scotty Bowman. IYKYK

[100565]

Bob Grove
@bobgrove91
At 13.3%, at the moment, the Pens’ PP is worst in team history. The team record for worst conversion rate in one season is 13.6% in 1967-68.

At this point in a season, goal differential typically matches with playoff position. This year Pens are anomaly. Extra strange cause the PP is so bad.

[DelPen]

I think someone is tracking games where we lost by one or 1+ an EN and the PP was really bad, like 0-4 or something. Point being if the PP was competent we would probably have a good 7-12 more points. Possibly even more.

[Antonio]

I mean, the problem with pure % based analysis, is that it does not factor in whether you would get a goal when you needed it 3 times or if you would just get 3 goals in a meaningless game...both yield the same "improvement". What I think we did see clearly was in FLA game, a team that has less than 0 respect for the PP, nor should they. They took insane liberties because they had no worries about the PP. Obviously a non broken PP would have definitely won SOME points for sure that were given up...how many is a hard exercise. Problem is though, the PP is just a symptom of a very diseased patient with a seriously metastasized cancer. This team has so many issues, the PP is just one way they show themselves. All that aside, it is shocking that the PP could be this bad without doing it on purpose.

[KG]

Pittsburgh Penguins
@penguins
The Penguins have re-assigned forward Valtteri Puustinen and defenseman Ryan Shea to the
@WBSPenguins
.

Defenseman John Ludvig has been loaned to WBS for conditioning purposes.

Week off move. Wonder if Puljujarvi gets a contract during the week off.

[FLPensFan]

Pittsburgh Penguins
@penguins
The Penguins have re-assigned forward Valtteri Puustinen and defenseman Ryan Shea to the
@WBSPenguins
.

Defenseman John Ludvig has been loaned to WBS for conditioning purposes.

Week off move. Wonder if Puljujarvi gets a contract during the week off.

After the ASG break, I'd like to see Puljujarvi signed, and both he and Poulin recalled. Poulin-Eller-Puljujarvi could do some damage.

[Pens4Life]

Pittsburgh Penguins
@penguins
The Penguins have re-assigned forward Valtteri Puustinen and defenseman Ryan Shea to the
@WBSPenguins
.

Defenseman John Ludvig has been loaned to WBS for conditioning purposes.

Week off move. Wonder if Puljujarvi gets a contract during the week off.

After the ASG break, I'd like to see Puljujarvi signed, and both he and Poulin recalled. Poulin-Eller-Puljujarvi could do some damage.

Yep, I would like to see that line as well.. Puusty could be left in AHL for few weeks, he needs to get confidence back, scoring rythm..
I would also like to see Acciari on wing, let White C the 4th line, sit Carter for few games
Harkins - White - Acciari

[KG]

DK said on his podcast that the team did not like Rakell's game on the recent road trip. Wonder if Dubas would look to tinker by moving out Rakell and Smith for 2 similar salaried forwards. Saad, Kuzmenko, Anderson, Copp, Coleman all could be available.

Besides the Jake issue, I could see Dubas tinkering with Rakell and Smith to change the dynamic up.

[FLPensFan]

DK said on his podcast that the team did not like Rakell's game on the recent road trip. Wonder if Dubas would look to tinker by moving out Rakell and Smith for 2 similar salaried forwards. Saad, Kuzmenko, Anderson, Copp, Coleman all could be available.

Besides the Jake issue, I could see Dubas tinkering with Rakell and Smith to change the dynamic up.

The only one I really see as an option is Kuzmenko, maybe longshot Saad. Anderson and Copp are severely overpaid for their size. They both cost more than Smith and Rakell, and neither comes close to producing at the same rate. Coleman is 32 (more of what we have), 5'11" (even more of what we have), and is having a career year which will drive up his price and potentially bite us next year and beyond.

I don't think STL will want to move Saad. He's the right combination of size, production, and cost...although he doesn't play a physical game. If STL were to trade him, I would think we would need to do something around Rakell, not Smith. Maybe Rakell plus something else, but, I still don't think STL moves him. They are in a WC spot right now.

Kuzmenko, at least there has been talk that he could be moved. But Vancouver may push for Guentzel instead of Rakell or Smith. Vancouver could gamble that Smith is a more consistent player and his playoff experience would be a help.

[Guinness]

DK said on his podcast that the team did not like Rakell's game on the recent road trip. Wonder if Dubas would look to tinker by moving out Rakell and Smith for 2 similar salaried forwards. Saad, Kuzmenko, Anderson, Copp, Coleman all could be available.

Besides the Jake issue, I could see Dubas tinkering with Rakell and Smith to change the dynamic up.

I don't have data on this, so this is just straight up gut, speculation - but it doesn't seem to me like teams trade players whom they had just signed 7 months ago or so. Smith, maybe... if I remember correctly he has one year left on his deal? Not sure... but maybe it might make sense to cut bait with him. But they just signed Rakell to a 5 year deal. I don't think it's good management to veer from that to trading him in such a short span of time, UNLESS the return is just too good to pass up.

But I could be wrong on that. I can't think of too many times GM's flipped on a player that they'd given a long-term contract to in such a short amount of time. Also, speaking as a person who manages personnel, it's generally not a good look to bring someone in to your group and then all of a sudden reverse course before they ever really got a chance to get their clothes dirty... it creates uncertainty amongst the rest of the group, and puts things in their mind that actually distracts them from their jobs. And in some cases causes them to go looking for somewhere else to work.

[largegarlic]

DK said on his podcast that the team did not like Rakell's game on the recent road trip. Wonder if Dubas would look to tinker by moving out Rakell and Smith for 2 similar salaried forwards. Saad, Kuzmenko, Anderson, Copp, Coleman all could be available.

Besides the Jake issue, I could see Dubas tinkering with Rakell and Smith to change the dynamic up.

I don't have data on this, so this is just straight up gut, speculation - but it doesn't seem to me like teams trade players whom they had just signed 7 months ago or so. Smith, maybe... if I remember correctly he has one year left on his deal? Not sure... but maybe it might make sense to cut bait with him. But they just signed Rakell to a 5 year deal. I don't think it's good management to veer from that to trading him in such a short span of time, UNLESS the return is just too good to pass up.

But I could be wrong on that. I can't think of too many times GM's flipped on a player that they'd given a long-term contract to in such a short amount of time. Also, speaking as a person who manages personnel, it's generally not a good look to bring someone in to your group and then all of a sudden reverse course before they ever really got a chance to get their clothes dirty... it creates uncertainty amongst the rest of the group, and puts things in their mind that actually distracts them from their jobs. And in some cases causes them to go looking for somewhere else to work.

Yeah, I don't have data either, but this seems right to me too. I would say the same thing applies to Graves. He's been a dud so far, but it's hard to see the GM who signed him shipping him out ~6 months into a 6 year deal. Maybe if Smith says that he really only wants to play in Vegas and never wanted to leave, you look at taking what you can get for him instead of dealing with a disgruntled guy who doesn't want to be here and isn't likely to be productive (if that's what is really going on with Smith...no idea if that is actually true).

[KG]

It's the bye-week not much to discuss. What about this random idea:

PLD in LA. They've dropped 14 of 16. Most likely they will have to fire their coach. PLD has not fit in. They gave him a very long term contract at $8.5mill AAV. He is only 25 and is a skilled big center coming off 60+ point season.

I would love to find a 2C to take over and move Geno to the wing. Maybe Jake could be part of the deal with LA (with retention on the PLD contract) and Geno could be Sid's new LW.

Top 2 centers are hard to come by in this league.

I doubt Blake would trade him because that would be admitting a huge mistake and would most likely lead to him being fired, but for discussion purposes only...

[largegarlic]

DK said on his podcast that the team did not like Rakell's game on the recent road trip. Wonder if Dubas would look to tinker by moving out Rakell and Smith for 2 similar salaried forwards. Saad, Kuzmenko, Anderson, Copp, Coleman all could be available.

Besides the Jake issue, I could see Dubas tinkering with Rakell and Smith to change the dynamic up.

I do wonder what is up with Rakell. I really liked his game since we acquired him up to the beginning of this season. Then he had that epic cold streak and got injured. Now, his production is trending back in the right direction, but he looks off still based on the eye test.

[FLPensFan]

DK said on his podcast that the team did not like Rakell's game on the recent road trip. Wonder if Dubas would look to tinker by moving out Rakell and Smith for 2 similar salaried forwards. Saad, Kuzmenko, Anderson, Copp, Coleman all could be available.

Besides the Jake issue, I could see Dubas tinkering with Rakell and Smith to change the dynamic up.

I don't have data on this, so this is just straight up gut, speculation - but it doesn't seem to me like teams trade players whom they had just signed 7 months ago or so. Smith, maybe... if I remember correctly he has one year left on his deal? Not sure... but maybe it might make sense to cut bait with him. But they just signed Rakell to a 5 year deal. I don't think it's good management to veer from that to trading him in such a short span of time, UNLESS the return is just too good to pass up.

But I could be wrong on that. I can't think of too many times GM's flipped on a player that they'd given a long-term contract to in such a short amount of time. Also, speaking as a person who manages personnel, it's generally not a good look to bring someone in to your group and then all of a sudden reverse course before they ever really got a chance to get their clothes dirty... it creates uncertainty amongst the rest of the group, and puts things in their mind that actually distracts them from their jobs. And in some cases causes them to go looking for somewhere else to work.

Yeah, I don't have data either, but this seems right to me too. I would say the same thing applies to Graves. He's been a dud so far, but it's hard to see the GM who signed him shipping him out ~6 months into a 6 year deal. Maybe if Smith says that he really only wants to play in Vegas and never wanted to leave, you look at taking what you can get for him instead of dealing with a disgruntled guy who doesn't want to be here and isn't likely to be productive (if that's what is really going on with Smith...no idea if that is actually true).

You are correct that you don't typically sign a guy to a multi-year deal, then trade him away within a year. Not very common. However, in a case like Smith, there are rumors he's not happy here. Not sure I buy that he just wants to go to Vegas, because Vegas dumped him to make cap space. I don't think they have the room to bring him back. Vegas would likely have to send us Barbashev or Marchessault back in a deal for Smith....and that ain't happening. So then Smith needs to decide if he wants to suck it up, or move anywhere but here.

On Rakell, though, I don't think we'll be blown away by an offer. If they want to deal him, it's because they either decide they need space, or want to try something else because he's not playing well in year one of his contract. I doubt this happens, but if they did move on from him, unless there is a GM out there that really likes his skillset and thinks he'll be fine moving forward. I don't see Rakell playing like Rakell. When he first came here, I was blown away by his passing vision, as well as his willingness to use the body to separate guys from pucks. I don't see him doing any of that anymore, and my gut tells me there are a lot of guys (*cough, Karlsson*) that aren't allowed to play "their game" under Sullivan.

[dark_forces]

DK said on his podcast that the team did not like Rakell's game on the recent road trip. Wonder if Dubas would look to tinker by moving out Rakell and Smith for 2 similar salaried forwards. Saad, Kuzmenko, Anderson, Copp, Coleman all could be available.

Besides the Jake issue, I could see Dubas tinkering with Rakell and Smith to change the dynamic up.

I don't have data on this, so this is just straight up gut, speculation - but it doesn't seem to me like teams trade players whom they had just signed 7 months ago or so. Smith, maybe... if I remember correctly he has one year left on his deal? Not sure... but maybe it might make sense to cut bait with him. But they just signed Rakell to a 5 year deal. I don't think it's good management to veer from that to trading him in such a short span of time, UNLESS the return is just too good to pass up.

But I could be wrong on that. I can't think of too many times GM's flipped on a player that they'd given a long-term contract to in such a short amount of time. Also, speaking as a person who manages personnel, it's generally not a good look to bring someone in to your group and then all of a sudden reverse course before they ever really got a chance to get their clothes dirty... it creates uncertainty amongst the rest of the group, and puts things in their mind that actually distracts them from their jobs. And in some cases causes them to go looking for somewhere else to work.

Yeah, I don't have data either, but this seems right to me too. I would say the same thing applies to Graves. He's been a dud so far, but it's hard to see the GM who signed him shipping him out ~6 months into a 6 year deal. Maybe if Smith says that he really only wants to play in Vegas and never wanted to leave, you look at taking what you can get for him instead of dealing with a disgruntled guy who doesn't want to be here and isn't likely to be productive (if that's what is really going on with Smith...no idea if that is actually true).

Rakell was signed by Hextall, so Dubas doesn't have a connection to him. I would think he would be fair game to be dealt, given the right deal. As for Smith, rumor has it that he misses Vegas and is unhappy. Wjo knows if there's truth to it, but he is a 32 yr old with one year left on his deal and potentially would appeal to a playoff bound team. I wouldn't be surprised to see either or even both dealt assuming the right deal comes along. Who knows? Maybe a new winger would click better with Malkin or would allow Rust to shift down to the second line and provide Sid's line with flexibility.

[Dynasty1970]

Ever notice how players exit the Penguins and then start producing? What does that say for our coaching staff. It tells me that their style is old and tired and not getting the most out of its players. Now we got a bunch of players that produced prior to coming here and have slowed down to a trickle of their production. This all points to Sully. How can GMKD not see this? Before he gets rid of anyone I think he has to start with the coaching staff as it is easier to replace them than it is to find quality players. I would hate to cast off a bunch of players that go on to produce elsewhere and be stuck with this same underperforming coaching staff trying to fit a bunch of new square pegs into round holes.