NHL Expansion: Seattle, Quebec City, Las Vegas?

[pittsoccer33]

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nhl-puck- ... --nhl.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Plans for a new, 20,000-seat arena in Paradise, Nevada, have been discussed for several years, but nothing has been made official. Given the money in the market, getting a facility up and working in a short period of time is the least of concerns for Las Vegas.

Ownership would be vital, and the Maloof family, which sold the NBA's Sacramento Kings earlier this year, could be in the discussion. Joe and Gavin Maloof have looked into bringing an NHL team to Las Vegas and even met with Bettman to discuss it, according to an April report in the Sacramento Bee.

Is Vegas a good idea? I imagine games where 70% of the arena is there to see the visiting team.

[Beveridge]

Imagine the Russian mob scenarios that could unfold with a team in Vegas. Although I believe a Las Vegas team would be banned from being parts of any bet.

[Idoit40fans]

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nhl-puck- ... --nhl.html

Plans for a new, 20,000-seat arena in Paradise, Nevada, have been discussed for several years, but nothing has been made official. Given the money in the market, getting a facility up and working in a short period of time is the least of concerns for Las Vegas.

Ownership would be vital, and the Maloof family, which sold the NBA's Sacramento Kings earlier this year, could be in the discussion. Joe and Gavin Maloof have looked into bringing an NHL team to Las Vegas and even met with Bettman to discuss it, according to an April report in the Sacramento Bee.

Is Vegas a good idea? I imagine games where 70% of the arena is there to see the visiting team.

I imagine games where 70% of the arena is empty. On weekends. In the team's first season.

[MRandall25]

You mean Phoenix?

[Idoit40fans]

They wouldnt be able to draw as much as phoenix or even Glendale

[Lt. Dish]

Why would you put a team in Seattle when there's a team ~150 miles away in Vancouver? Makes zero sense to me. That's closer than Columbus and Pittsburgh.

[mikey287]

I didn't click the link (mainly because I don't care for Yahoo's hockey coverage), but Seattle is gaining a lot of steam with the league. They support a junior club, they have shown that they have passionate sports fans despite the impression given from everyone on Frasier (except Marty) and it would give Vancouver a nice rival actually that harkens back to the old pre-consolidation days where there was a league in the east and a league out on the coast. The soccer team's fans seem ravenous, I know the Seahawks fans are impressive - it might be the toughest place to play in the NFL this side of Kansas City and the kicker - the NHL gets a market that the NBA isn't in...they get a foothold there and you might have something.

If they wanted to skip out on Las Vegas...Portland, OR would not be a bad spot either...instead rivalry with Seattle and probably Vancouver...

Vegas is obviously a concern of the pro sports leagues...gambling isn't that big of a deal with the NHL (in Canada, you see advertisements during games to bet on games and what not...). The issue is the fan base. It's a little bit unpredictable what they'd get out of it. Speaking in generalities, LV seems like a night town, a lot of people work at night...a lot of people are out at night...a lot of tourists (but it's also a very populous area)...

Location would be huge...if you get something right in the heart of Vegas, with a casino downstairs and slot machines in the concession areas, you'd be ok...if you put it out in some far-flung, dusty suburb like the Phoenix Coyotes did by playing in Glendale, you're in trouble...but you could drive a lot of gate, even if you don't drive a lot of "real" attendance...

Casinos and hotels would be big buyers of season tickets, giving them out as a rewards, comps for big spenders, what have you...it's a boom or bust proposal, but worth exploring...

[Dickie Dunn]

Las Vegas is an event town. 41 homes games a year isn't an event.

[Pitt87]

Las Vegas is an event town. 41 homes games a year isn't an event.

Er, Cirque du Soleil disagrees... they seem to do OK selling out daily shows in every casino on the strip....

[columbia]

Just think of all of the people vacationing from Atlanta, who might want to check out that exotic sport called "hockey", which they believe might have once been played in their home town.

I know that Winterhawks tickets can be hard to come by, so that's something to consider.
Seattle is a no brainer.

[Dickie Dunn]

Las Vegas is an event town. 41 homes games a year isn't an event.

Er, Cirque du Soleil disagrees... they seem to do OK selling out daily shows in every casino on the strip....

Largely by tourists. Sports, especially hockey, depend on strong local fan bases. Nobody is going to Vegas to see a hockey game.

[mikey287]

Well, it's definitely not nobody...but how much is a valid question. But there are wide stretches of North America that don't live really live close to pro hockey...and it's an international destination, so this factor is multiplied. Additionally, I think LV is like a top-25 metro area in the country or thereabouts, so there will be people...but how they take to having a pro sports team is undecided...

But if you rig it up for people to sit there and make little prop bets on it, really glitz it up, you could attract some butts to the seats...like I said, it's the establishments that will really bolster the season ticket base...the Las Vegas team in the ECHL doesn't do bad certainly...

It's a gamble (no pun intended) but I don't think it should be so quickly dismissed...I'm not in love with the idea, but it's worth thinking about...Seattle should be the next city to get a team though regardless of how...

[Idoit40fans]

You arent selling merchandise for a vegas team though when youre relying heavily on vacationers.

[mikey287]

It's a fair point, but I can't imagine a scenario where such a small piece of the pie is relevant. I'm picturing the owners owning the arena and the team, they just have to make the property, so to speak, profitable...

I mean, I don't want another sad sack team in the league, the talent is already diluted enough it looks like, but it won't be jersey sales that pushes this team into the black in Las Vegas...that arena just needs to push the pace...

[Idoit40fans]

Why lose that money when you have options in cities whose only industy isnt tourism.

That was worded wrong

[mikey287]

Don't disagree...in fact, I said, that it's a gamble and that don't love the idea and that Seattle should definitely be next...

The only thing I really disagreed with is the "never" (paraphrased from some others) part, which is the smart money play in this case.

[Pitts]

Why would you put a team in Seattle when there's a team ~150 miles away in Vancouver? Makes zero sense to me. That's closer than Columbus and Pittsburgh.

Because one is in the US and the other is in Canada? I think Seattle, or Portland would be great locations.

[MRandall25]

Why would you put a team in Seattle when there's a team ~150 miles away in Vancouver? Makes zero sense to me. That's closer than Columbus and Pittsburgh.

Why put 3 teams in the New York metropolitan area?

Answers: money, population, money.

Same reason why some people want 2 Toronto teams.

[shoeshine boy]

Just think of all of the people vacationing from Atlanta, who might want to check out that exotic sport called "hockey", which they believe might have once been played in their home town.

damn, I hate it when you're right.

[Headshot77]

33 teams would be even worse than the lopsided conferences we have now, lol. I want Quebec and Seattle, but LV isn't a terrible option either.

[Idoit40fans]

As far as alignment, i dont think it would be worse. As far as quality if the league...they have too many teams now, so of course more teams will be worse.

By the way is KC out?

[mikey287]

I'd be okay, as I've said many times, with reducing roster spots to slow the game down...but the Union will never go for that (for good reason, I don't blame them, but ultimately, that's the cure for a lot of what ails us...)

I'll make a logical leap regarding an odd number of teams...here goes...

People think that scoring = excitement, scoring was higher in the 80's, there was an odd-number of teams (21) all throughout the 80's, so people will find an odd number of teams exciting.

[Lt. Dish]

Why would you put a team in Seattle when there's a team ~150 miles away in Vancouver? Makes zero sense to me. That's closer than Columbus and Pittsburgh.

Why put 3 teams in the New York metropolitan area?

Answers: money, population, money.

Same reason why some people want 2 Toronto teams.

Pitts and MRandall, I suppose. I'm not trying to be daft; I know $$$ makes the world go around in these matters. I'm thinking theoretically w/re: competitive overlap and TV. Would you expect the Canucks to protest expansion in Seattle? Could they? Just curious. I thought I saw some articles about the Maple Leafs and MLSE protesting putting another Ontario team in Hamilton, citing competition and TV. Then again, the Leafs enjoy bloviating about many things.

Sea-Tac-Bellevue has about .5m more than Portand, so, while not even, it's comparable. I guess looking at that and the geography, since overlap is considered for competitive and TV purposes, it seems Portland, Oregon would make more sense. Just a guess. I'm sure (I hope) several market studies are being done. I'm not at all against expansion.

[Idoit40fans]

I think it would be difficult to make that argument about a team in another major city in another country.

[Lt. Dish]

I think it would be difficult to make that argument about a team in another major city in another country.

This is a good point, and one I'd like to understand better. While national borders would absolutely be factored in, to what extent does the "different country" issue affect what the league wants to do, considering that it's a North American league? I know North America isn't a sovereign entity here. I just find it interesting, is all.