Other NHL games 2013-2014 season

[sniper]

If they were both swapped in places(and Koivu was actually healthy ever) I'm sure Koivu would be thought of as better.

I agree. There are players Toews gets rated ahead of and I'm not sure he deserves it. Switch him with Spezza and which one is getting the guaranteed Team Canada spot right now? Toews is better on defense still, but Spezza and him have produced roughly the same offensively this year and on Chicago I'd imagine Spezza would have much better numbers. I cringe a little when I see Toews ranked as a top 5 player in the league. He's solid for sure. I'm not sure he's super star material.

I said it yesterday but if Chicago had to deal with the injuries that the Pens have had the past few years they wouldn't of lasted a second. The fact they never have injuries to Toews, Kane, Keith, Seabrook is powerball like luck

They have been very lucky. They've gotten a bunch of goals from their depth players. I would like to see how they would fair without multiple star players for a length of time to see if those depth guys continue to produce or if they are just scoring against lesser competition. It's bound to happen some time. Might be during the playoffs. You never know.

[sniper]

Yeah, I can see where you're coming from, but I don't really agree with it. Mikko Koivu is one of my favorite players, I wish he was as good Toews...

I think Toews was on the third line for Canada with Mike Richards and Rick Nash. They got a lot done certainly. And I mean, I want do you want Slovakia to do? Canada is so deep, I'm thinking Joe Thornton or Patrice Bergeron being the 4th line center, I'm not sure we should punish Toews for that, considering that this is a best-on-best tournament that he was invited to (and he was an integral part of the winning team)...and it only happens every four years...

In every day life, he does face the stiffest competition almost every night...best defensive players to try to shut him down, sometimes best offensive players for him to shutdown - especially now that they don't have Dave Bolland, a tremendous hit to their flimsy center depth...Kruger doing decent work, Handzus is fine but is one of the slowest top-9 forwards in the league, then young Pirri or role player Shaw are also in the mix...not a lot to work with...puts a lot of pressure on Toews, and he's responded as well as he always has...

Linemates might help out Jonathan Toews, but Sidney Crosby having Evgeni Malkin to take some of the pressure off is huge for him...defenses have to prepare for two lines, not one...having four strong centers is a great spine for a winning team...even when the three-center system was more prominent, teams with four strong centers seemed to be more successful until it caught on for good...

I think Toews has done everything asked of him and more in his career at every level...he's rated pretty properly, I do believe...

I'm not blaming Toews for anything. He can't help who other Olympic teams match up against his line. He took advantage of it as he was expected to do. It just seems to me like everyone was like wow Toews was the star of the Olympics! Well yeah he produced, but he had far better matchups then the top lines because Canada has better depth than other teams. There isn't anything those teams can do about that. He did his job and took advantage of those favorable matchups. I don't think he out produced what should have been expected of him. Yet after the Olympics everyone was all look how great Toews is.

I agree that he faces the other teams best D men the same as other teams star players. I'd say he has better linemates than several he seems to be ranked above though. Who are Spezza, Koivu (until the last two years), Tavares, E. Staal playing with who are anywhere near as talented as what Toews has had? They produce nearly equal or better than him, but Toews gets rated higher. Consider who Toews linemates have been and as highly as he's rated it's almost hard to believe the guy has only had one point per game or better season.

Yes Crosby and Malkin have each other to deflect pressure and that helps a ton, yet both have shown they can carry the team with lesser linemates when the other one has missed significant time. Toews hasn't done that. In fact I'd argue he doesn't actually carry his team when everyone is healthy. He has led his own team in scoring only once and if it wasn't for Kane and Sharp missing a few games he may have finished 3rd that year.

I think he's a very good player, but I think he's very over rated and will continue to think that until he shows he can carry a lesser team with lesser linemates like some of the guys I mentioned above have shown. He reminds me a bit of Mike Richards when he was in Philly. I think he's better than Mike, but I think the level of over ratedness (that's not a word) is nearly the same. Both are solid players, but they aren't super stars. Richards doesn't get nearly the fan/media attention now that he did then.

I agree he's done what's asked of him and because of the teams he's been on and lines he has played with that has been enough, but I want to see him carry a team before I rate him so highly. Despite the Olympic gold and two Cups as captain I really can't say I've seen him do it. Their first cup run was the nearest he's come to doing that. That's not enough for me. He's been in the league long enough to show more than 22 games.

[Idoit40fans]

I think Toews has done everything asked of him and more in his career at every level...he's rated pretty properly, I do believe...

When you say this, are you responding to the idea that hes a top 5 player? Or that in general hes properly rated? I think hes a fringe top 5 center, and certainly not a top 5 player. As far as one of the greats winners and an easy lock for Canada, definitely. Hes got miles of hear and seems to be someone that can seemingly always reach back into the tank for a little more. If Canada needs to win that faceoff at the end of the game, hes the guy I want taking it. Or rather the last guy i want takin it if its against the US. I just think hes in a great situation to show a lot. He may not have a malkin on the second line behind him dividing defense's attention, but he does have 17 other skaters out there with him that can be counted on to the point that the team can send out a pretty average NHL goalie and dominate. Back to Koivu, i dont really think Koivu is better, but i think a lot of people would see him as better if they switched places.

[sniper]

I think Toews has done everything asked of him and more in his career at every level...he's rated pretty properly, I do believe...

When you say this, are you responding to the idea that hes a top 5 player? Or that in general hes properly rated? I think hes a fringe top 5 center, and certainly not a top 5 player. As far as one of the greats winners and an easy lock for Canada, definitely. Hes got miles of hear and seems to be someone that can seemingly always reach back into the tank for a little more. If Canada needs to win that faceoff at the end of the game, hes the guy I want taking it. Or rather the last guy i want takin it if its against the US. I just think hes in a great situation to show a lot. He may not have a malkin on the second line behind him dividing defense's attention, but he does have 17 other skaters out there with him that can be counted on to the point that the team can send out a pretty average NHL goalie and dominate. Back to Koivu, i dont really think Koivu is better, but i think a lot of people would see him as better if they switched places.

I'd want Bergeron to take that faceoff, but Toews would be my second choice. I think Bergeron is a little better at them. I agree with your post though.

[mikey287]

I think Toews has done everything asked of him and more in his career at every level...he's rated pretty properly, I do believe...

When you say this, are you responding to the idea that hes a top 5 player? Or that in general hes properly rated? I think hes a fringe top 5 center, and certainly not a top 5 player. As far as one of the greats winners and an easy lock for Canada, definitely. Hes got miles of hear and seems to be someone that can seemingly always reach back into the tank for a little more. If Canada needs to win that faceoff at the end of the game, hes the guy I want taking it. Or rather the last guy i want takin it if its against the US. I just think hes in a great situation to show a lot. He may not have a malkin on the second line behind him dividing defense's attention, but he does have 17 other skaters out there with him that can be counted on to the point that the team can send out a pretty average NHL goalie and dominate. Back to Koivu, i dont really think Koivu is better, but i think a lot of people would see him as better if they switched places.

No, I don't believe he's a top 5 player...I think that post came in while I was typing that post above. In general, I feel he's properly rated, but there are a number of people that take it too far. Jason Spezza has better raw talent than him, John Tavares is just flat out better, etc.

As for top 5 centers, you're talking about Crosby, Malkin and Stamkos being ahead of him pretty firmly I have to believe, I have Tavares as being next and better, but now, right here, I think you really have to start to consider him along with a couple others. So, "fringe top 5 center" would be something I would subscribe too, as illustrated...

And yes, Koivu - who has been criminally underrated since he's been in the league (my eyes gaze over to my Team Finland World Juniors jersey adorned with "Koivu" and a big number 9 hanging on my wall since long before he played in the NHL) - would be much more highly regarded if he played for the Blackhawks...Koivu has played largely on defensive teams and largely in irrelevance...he has no playoff experience (three first round exits I think, not even a game 7 I don't believe...) and don't look now, he's 31 in a couple months...I don't want to bring down my own guy here, but Mikko Koivu to Jonathan Toews is a stretch that even Mikko's biggest fan can't quite bridge...though I'd love to believe it. But you're definitely right, Mikko would have some more jersey sales and some more press if he wore the Chief on his chest instead of that thing that people don't realize is an animal too...

Mikko is playing older brother Saku for the 18th time right now...is there anyone in the Eastern time zone watching it besides me...?

[Idoit40fans]

I was going to mention bergeron in that sentence. Hes probably a better faceoff guy in general, but id still want toews taking a big faceoff...also you have to consider which side of the ice its on.

[Idoit40fans]

Haha im listening to the hockey game and reading a book in bed. That basically means that im neither absorbing anything fromthe book nor following the game. By the way, completely forgot they sent Grant overthere until the goal.

[Gaucho]

Me too. Grant scored in his first two NHL games. Good for him. On a related note, I forgot that Jake Muzzin was originally drafted by the Penguins.

[shoeshine boy]

I just picked up LA's Martin Jones in every Fantasy League I could. where'd this kid come from????

[meow]

I just picked up LA's Martin Jones in every Fantasy League I could. where'd this kid come from????

The goalie factory that is the LA Kings

[mikey287]

I just picked up LA's Martin Jones in every Fantasy League I could. where'd this kid come from????

He's been a winner at every level really, I think the Kings found him in Calgary with the Hitmen of the WHL and they kept an eye on him and he's just impressed them because it all just comes so easy to him...really great economy of movement with him, he's just big and square and he's on top of it. He's an easy goalie to hit with the puck. He's made some saves where he's had to go outside of the box and looked pretty good making them...he's been working with Billy Ranford and doing a good job with him and he just kind of does his thing...the Kings play really strong defense again and he's not giving up any softies...

It was actually Marc Crawford who I think spotted him as he played bantam (I think, Bantam) with his son or nephew or something...

[profpolisci]

I've got a feeling there are going to some shenanigans in Philly this evening.

[MRandall25]

Henrik Lundqvist sucks this year. Gives up a goal 38 seconds into the game, and just gave up another to the Blue Jackets.

[bhaw]

Henrik Lundqvist sucks this year. Gives up a goal 38 seconds into the game, and just gave up another to the Blue Jackets.

Lies. I've learned there is only 1 goalie in the NHL that does that crap!

[profpolisci]

Henrik Lundqvist sucks this year. Gives up a goal 38 seconds into the game, and just gave up another to the Blue Jackets.

Lies. I've learned there is only 1 goalie in the NHL that does that crap!

Good one

[Gaucho]

Now McEllhinney is out, too.

[Gaucho]

Injured, that is. How long is Bobrovsky expected to be out?

[MRandall25]

It was 4-6 weeks from his injury, IIRC.

Mike McKenna is the replacement. Good guy. Definitely has paid his dues (Blue Jackets are his 6th team or something like that, not counting AHL affiliates).

[columbia]

Gionta can't buy a goal.
Scott Gomez Syndrome?

[Idoit40fans]

Strome held out till saturday, which is great since i will be at a bar watching the Pens and unable to watch it. I guess ill watch it Sunday morning. Boo. I guess ill watch Dallas :sadface:

[profpolisci]

Geez, Dubnyk

[columbia]

Bertuzzi excelling on the SO.

[sniper]

Bertuzzi excelling on the SO.

Result was the same as everyone else on his team.

[Idoit40fans]

St louis is the 6th shooter they send. Why?

[canaan]

I didn't understand that either.