The Official LGP Pittsburgh Sport Radio Thread

[columbia]

I don't think they are immature or misinformed. If I draw 100,000 people to a stadium to watch me play and watch my jersey being sold for 100 bucks in the bookstore, and I see zero dollars of that, then its not surprising to see that I am going to try to get my own cut by selling memorabilia, or taking free cars, etc. I don't think they are victims either, because the rules are what the rules are, and they know they risk being kicked out of school as a result. But they're nothing more than free labor and a money making machine for deal old alma mater. The NCAA is a fraud.

Yea forget that free $60000 education that should teach them the skills they need to provide for their family for the rest of their lives. Its somehow unjust that they don't get paid after the free education, food, shelter, and extra on campus benefits he receives. Poor, poor kids. Oh, and this tool bag knew if he waited 3-4 years HE WOULD BE A MILLIONAIRE!!! Don't tell me that they are abused and taken adavantage of. Just because they choose not to take advantage of the compensation offered to them doesn't mean they should be able to take other, improper benefits.

If I'm a top college athlete, I'd rather be paid market value for what I bring in and pay my own tuition, etc out of that.
Only then, am I being properly compensated for the revenue I generate.

[slappybrown]

I don't think they are immature or misinformed. If I draw 100,000 people to a stadium to watch me play and watch my jersey being sold for 100 bucks in the bookstore, and I see zero dollars of that, then its not surprising to see that I am going to try to get my own cut by selling memorabilia, or taking free cars, etc. I don't think they are victims either, because the rules are what the rules are, and they know they risk being kicked out of school as a result. But they're nothing more than free labor and a money making machine for deal old alma mater. The NCAA is a fraud.

Yea forget that free $60000 education that should teach them the skills they need to provide for their family for the rest of their lives. Its somehow unjust that they don't get paid after the free education, food, shelter, and extra on campus benefits he receives. Poor, poor kids. Oh, and this tool bag knew if he waited 3-4 years HE WOULD BE A MILLIONAIRE!!! Don't tell me that they are abused and taken adavantage of. Just because they choose not to take advantage of the compensation offered to them doesn't mean they should be able to take other, improper benefits.

Yea, Terrelle Pryor went to OSU to learn "communications" or "sports management." I agree -- he can't take those other benefits without taking the punishment in the event that the NCAA finds out about it. I'm not disagreeing with the punishment; I'm disagreeing with the very notion of what the NCAA supposedly stands for with respect to minor league football and basketball.

In what other industry or occupation could you receive a paltry fraction of the economic benefit you provide? Why is it ok that the NCAA is signing 11 BILLION DOLLAR TV contracts for March Madness, and in exchange you receive the dictated terms of a free scholarship? In no other job or industry would that be acceptable. Why is it ok in college sports?

"Just because they choose not to take advantage of the compensation offered to them doesn't mean they should be able to take other, improper benefits."

Is that negotiated? The compensation is not "offered" to them -- its imposed upon them. Why should anyone have to "wait" to do receive the true value of his talents? Because you, or the NCAA says so? It's a joke.

And no, the professional amateur athletes playing D1 football have no other choice. They can't apply for membership in the only professional football league (you know, the one with the antitrust exemptions) until their junior year. I'd imagine the UFL/CFL have similar rules in place as well. The NCAA is a sham.

[Malkamaniac]

I don't think they are immature or misinformed. If I draw 100,000 people to a stadium to watch me play and watch my jersey being sold for 100 bucks in the bookstore, and I see zero dollars of that, then its not surprising to see that I am going to try to get my own cut by selling memorabilia, or taking free cars, etc. I don't think they are victims either, because the rules are what the rules are, and they know they risk being kicked out of school as a result. But they're nothing more than free labor and a money making machine for deal old alma mater. The NCAA is a fraud.

Yea forget that free $60000 education that should teach them the skills they need to provide for their family for the rest of their lives. Its somehow unjust that they don't get paid after the free education, food, shelter, and extra on campus benefits he receives. Poor, poor kids. Oh, and this tool bag knew if he waited 3-4 years HE WOULD BE A MILLIONAIRE!!! Don't tell me that they are abused and taken adavantage of. Just because they choose not to take advantage of the compensation offered to them doesn't mean they should be able to take other, improper benefits.

Pryor jersey outsold that free education in the first year.

[slappybrown]

I don't think they are immature or misinformed. If I draw 100,000 people to a stadium to watch me play and watch my jersey being sold for 100 bucks in the bookstore, and I see zero dollars of that, then its not surprising to see that I am going to try to get my own cut by selling memorabilia, or taking free cars, etc. I don't think they are victims either, because the rules are what the rules are, and they know they risk being kicked out of school as a result. But they're nothing more than free labor and a money making machine for deal old alma mater. The NCAA is a fraud.

Yea forget that free $60000 education that should teach them the skills they need to provide for their family for the rest of their lives. Its somehow unjust that they don't get paid after the free education, food, shelter, and extra on campus benefits he receives. Poor, poor kids. Oh, and this tool bag knew if he waited 3-4 years HE WOULD BE A MILLIONAIRE!!! Don't tell me that they are abused and taken adavantage of. Just because they choose not to take advantage of the compensation offered to them doesn't mean they should be able to take other, improper benefits.

If I'm a top college athlete, I'd rather be paid market value for what I bring in and pay my own tuition, etc out of that.
Only then, am I being properly compensated for the revenue I generate.

Bingo. Anything less is patronizing, jealous, or some combination of both.

[slappybrown]

I don't think they are immature or misinformed. If I draw 100,000 people to a stadium to watch me play and watch my jersey being sold for 100 bucks in the bookstore, and I see zero dollars of that, then its not surprising to see that I am going to try to get my own cut by selling memorabilia, or taking free cars, etc. I don't think they are victims either, because the rules are what the rules are, and they know they risk being kicked out of school as a result. But they're nothing more than free labor and a money making machine for deal old alma mater. The NCAA is a fraud.

Yea forget that free $60000 education that should teach them the skills they need to provide for their family for the rest of their lives. Its somehow unjust that they don't get paid after the free education, food, shelter, and extra on campus benefits he receives. Poor, poor kids. Oh, and this tool bag knew if he waited 3-4 years HE WOULD BE A MILLIONAIRE!!! Don't tell me that they are abused and taken adavantage of. Just because they choose not to take advantage of the compensation offered to them doesn't mean they should be able to take other, improper benefits.

Pryor jersey outsold that free education in the first year.

[Malkamaniac]

I don't think they are immature or misinformed. If I draw 100,000 people to a stadium to watch me play and watch my jersey being sold for 100 bucks in the bookstore, and I see zero dollars of that, then its not surprising to see that I am going to try to get my own cut by selling memorabilia, or taking free cars, etc. I don't think they are victims either, because the rules are what the rules are, and they know they risk being kicked out of school as a result. But they're nothing more than free labor and a money making machine for deal old alma mater. The NCAA is a fraud.

Yea forget that free $60000 education that should teach them the skills they need to provide for their family for the rest of their lives. Its somehow unjust that they don't get paid after the free education, food, shelter, and extra on campus benefits he receives. Poor, poor kids. Oh, and this tool bag knew if he waited 3-4 years HE WOULD BE A MILLIONAIRE!!! Don't tell me that they are abused and taken adavantage of. Just because they choose not to take advantage of the compensation offered to them doesn't mean they should be able to take other, improper benefits.

Pryor jersey outsold that free education in the first year.

That's also not counting what money the made in school promotion in getting other players to attend because a top target like Pryor went there.

Sure, they get fringe benefits with stuff on campus, education, girls, etc etc. That doesn't get them that much money though, they have to do "illegal" NCAA things to do that.

[IanMoran]

They aren't FORCED to go to college... if they want and are that good they can join another league that doesn't have age restrictions (wouldn't be smart, but that is their decision). They signed up for it / so abide by the rules or suffer consequences if they are caught.

O and almost all athletic departments lose $, so while they bring in a ton of $ it is also really expensive so this whole universities should just pay the players isn't realistic

[slappybrown]

They aren't FORCED to go to college... if they want and are that good they can join another league that doesn't have age restrictions (wouldn't be smart, but that is there decision). They signed up for it / so abide by the rules or suffer consequences if they are caught.

O and almost all athletic departments lose $, so while they bring in a ton of $ it is also really expensive so this whole universities should just pat the players isn't realistic

What league? Where? 99% of professional football players in this country are in the NFL through the NFL Minor League NCAA D-1 football system. What professional football league has no age restrictions?

No one is arguing that Pryor's punishment was not in accordance with NCAA rules; rules he agreed to. The problem is the regime/rules in place are a sham.

Yes, athletic departments often lose money at smaller schools. But what does not lose money are their football and basketball programs. Those programs fund the rest of the sports that no one is paying money to see; that no one is paying for jerseys; that no one is watching on TV. How does that make Terrelle Pryor any less entitled to the true value of his services?

[slappybrown]

http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/football/b ... aaf-268222" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Found the article I was looking for from last year:

Obviously, if Green did sell a jersey, that's a violation: The NCAA passed explicit guidelines forbidding players to peddle memorabilia after nine Georgia players were rebuked (though not officially sanctioned, because no adequate guidelines existed at the time) for selling their 2002 SEC Championship rings on eBay. And everyone knows that impressionable student-athletes are strictly forbidden from profiting off their name or likeness as athletes. A.J. Green can't be allowed to go around cashing in on his fame when other players are (as far as we know) playing by the rules.

At least, not without cutting Georgia a slice of the profits, he can't. That seems to work just fine for everyone else: A quick Google Yahoo! search for a No. 8 A.J. Green jersey will take you here, for example, or here, or to any of the dozen A.J. Green replica jerseys currently up for bid on eBay, of all colors and sizes. As MSNBC's Darren Rovell points out, Georgia itself sells replica No. 8 jerseys at Sanford Stadium during home games. According to USA Today, the UGA athletic department as a whole brought in more than $9.2 million in "royalties, licensing, advertisements and sponsorships" during the 2008-09 school year, including things like replica jerseys for the most popular players. Not a dime of which goes into A.J. Green's or any other player's pocket, or else ... well, see above.

This isn't selling tickets. In any other avenue of American life, Green would have a stake in that business, because he essentially created it with his popular talent. But that could be any No. 8 who plays for Georgia, right? Or any No. 2 for Ohio State, or any No. 22 for Alabama, right? There are still a lot of Terrence Edwards fans around, you know. Go team!

[Point Breeze Penguins]

Most of the money made in College Athletics goes to the general fund of the individual university.

[IanMoran]

They aren't FORCED to go to college... if they want and are that good they can join another league that doesn't have age restrictions (wouldn't be smart, but that is there decision). They signed up for it / so abide by the rules or suffer consequences if they are caught.

O and almost all athletic departments lose $, so while they bring in a ton of $ it is also really expensive so this whole universities should just pat the players isn't realistic

What league? Where? 99% of professional football players in this country are in the NFL through the NFL Minor League NCAA D-1 football system. What professional football league has no age restrictions?

No one is arguing that Pryor's punishment was not in accordance with NCAA rules; rules he agreed to. The problem is the regime/rules in place are a sham.

Yes, athletic departments often lose money at smaller schools. But what does not lose money are their football and basketball programs. Those programs fund the rest of the sports that no one is paying money to see; that no one is paying for jerseys; that no one is watching on TV. How does that make Terrelle Pryor any less entitled to the true value of his services?

If they want then they can all form together, say !@#! the NCAA and someone can start their own minor league system... but then they wouldn't generate anywhere near the revenue (even if had same players) because people watch NCAA football because of allegence to their schools. The NCAA benefits from these players and the players benefit from NCAA. The only true talents who bring in a bunch of $ individually are getting free preparation for that huge NFL contract they will soon sign. The rest of the players who don't bring in that much are getting a college education (which has A LOT of value).

Yes, football / basketball bring in the $ to cover other sports, but if you ruin that than 98% of universities won't be able to offer any other athletic programs outside of those 2

[Malkamaniac]

lol they can all form together and create a league to rival another league that brings in billions of dollars because they've monopolized with the NFL in attaining the best route to get to said NFL.

[slappybrown]

They aren't FORCED to go to college... if they want and are that good they can join another league that doesn't have age restrictions (wouldn't be smart, but that is there decision). They signed up for it / so abide by the rules or suffer consequences if they are caught.

O and almost all athletic departments lose $, so while they bring in a ton of $ it is also really expensive so this whole universities should just pat the players isn't realistic

What league? Where? 99% of professional football players in this country are in the NFL through the NFL Minor League NCAA D-1 football system. What professional football league has no age restrictions?

No one is arguing that Pryor's punishment was not in accordance with NCAA rules; rules he agreed to. The problem is the regime/rules in place are a sham.

Yes, athletic departments often lose money at smaller schools. But what does not lose money are their football and basketball programs. Those programs fund the rest of the sports that no one is paying money to see; that no one is paying for jerseys; that no one is watching on TV. How does that make Terrelle Pryor any less entitled to the true value of his services?

If they want then they can all form together, say !@#! the NCAA and someone can start their own minor league system... but then they wouldn't generate anywhere near the revenue (even if had same players) because people watch NCAA football because of allegence to their schools. The NCAA benefits from these players and the players benefit from NCAA. The only true talents who bring in a bunch of $ individually are getting free preparation for that huge NFL contract they will soon sign. The rest of the players who don't bring in that much are getting a college education (which has A LOT of value).

Yes, football / basketball bring in the $ to cover other sports, but if you ruin that than 98% of universities won't be able to offer any other athletic programs outside of those 2

"The only true talents who bring in a bunch of $ individually are getting free preparation for that huge NFL contract they will soon sign."

Wow. "Free preparation." "Thanks State U, for letting me go out there and risk my life and limb to play football. In exchange, I will take some classes, and get a degree that would have cost me somewhere around 80-100K. In return, you receive millions of dollars in royalties, tv contracts, tickets, concessions, etc. I appreciate the free preparation though."

"The NCAA benefits from these players and the players benefit from NCAA."

Agreed. The problem is that the benefit provided to the NCAA far outweighs the benefit provided to the players. And those benefits are not subject to negotiation.

"The only true talents who bring in a bunch of $ individually are getting free preparation for that huge NFL contract they will soon sign."

This only applies to jerseys. The collective players are what drive TV contracts and attendance, which is where the real money is.

[Pavel Bure]

Back on task the argument was that they are/are not victims. I don't think they are in any way, shape, or form victims. I in fact encourage taking the handouts. My other argument was that Pryor isn't a good person and it's not because he took handouts. He's just a turd. His high-school exploits are well known around here and college speaks for itself. The guy is a bad egg and puts on a good face for the media now that he's been caught.

[Malkamaniac]

Back on task the argument was that they are/are not victims. I don't think they are in any way, shape, or form victims. I in fact encourage taking the handouts. My other argument was that Pryor isn't a good person and it's not because he took handouts. He's just a turd. His high-school exploits are well known around here and college speaks for itself. The guy is a bad egg and puts on a good face for the media now that he's been caught.

All of them have. I was in the storm down there when Pryor played for Jeanette. (I am from Greensburg). I think over anything, more people were butt hurt he didn't choose Penn State than anything.

I also don't believe that most of the stuff created was his original issue, I think his Mentors(even though Batch walked away) created a lot of garbage.

[joopen]

"The only true talents who bring in a bunch of $ individually are getting free preparation for that huge NFL contract they will soon sign."

This only applies to jerseys. The collective players are what drive TV contracts and attendance, which is where the real money is.

No, the conferences and the schools drive those. Are the networks signing a huge deal with the Big 10 because ZOMG!!!11!! OSU HAZ TIREL PRIOR? No they sign it because the history of the schools and the expectation that the conference continues at or above its current level of play. By your theory, they should go ahead and pay the recruits who have committed to the schools while they are still in HS because, ya know, they are driving that TV contract . They aren't professionals. When they are professionals then they can get paid. Apprentices go thru the same thing. College football is essentially an apprenticeship for the NFL. What about residencies for doctors? They are doing the same thing as full time MD's but aren't getting near the same compensation. Why shouldn't they just start taking medical supplies and sell them? They are driving the revenue for the hospital. So, yes it does happen in other avenues too. You do it and deal with it. Don't cheat and then whine like a little girl because the rules aren't fair. Life isn't fair. Wait 3 years and you will be fully compensated. Its not a difficult, or unusual concept.

[Malkamaniac]

"The only true talents who bring in a bunch of $ individually are getting free preparation for that huge NFL contract they will soon sign."

This only applies to jerseys. The collective players are what drive TV contracts and attendance, which is where the real money is.

No, the conferences and the schools drive those. Are the networks signing a huge deal with the Big 10 because ZOMG!!!11!! OSU HAZ TIREL PRIOR? No they sign it because the history of the schools and the expectation that the conference continues at or above its current level of play. By your theory, they should go ahead and pay the recruits who have committed to the schools while they are still in HS because, ya know, they are driving that TV contract . They aren't professionals. When they are professionals then they can get paid. Apprentices go thru the same thing. College football is essentially an apprenticeship for the NFL. What about residencies for doctors? They are doing the same thing as full time MD's but aren't getting near the same compensation. Why shouldn't they just start taking medical supplies and sell them? They are driving the revenue for the hospital. So, yes it does happen in other avenues too. You do it and deal with it. Don't cheat and then whine like a little girl because the rules aren't fair. Life isn't fair. Wait 3 years and you will be fully compensated. Its not a difficult, or unusual concept.

Unless you're a surgeon, I'd imagine by hurting his hand severly enough to not be able to perform surgery. Players risk the ability lose millions every second spent on the field while a jersey with their name on it, sells millions, because of the skill they've shown.

I'd say those two avenues of "unfairness" are completely different.

[doublem]

would anyone here turn down free stuff? Don't lie.

[joopen]

"The only true talents who bring in a bunch of $ individually are getting free preparation for that huge NFL contract they will soon sign."

This only applies to jerseys. The collective players are what drive TV contracts and attendance, which is where the real money is.

No, the conferences and the schools drive those. Are the networks signing a huge deal with the Big 10 because ZOMG!!!11!! OSU HAZ TIREL PRIOR? No they sign it because the history of the schools and the expectation that the conference continues at or above its current level of play. By your theory, they should go ahead and pay the recruits who have committed to the schools while they are still in HS because, ya know, they are driving that TV contract . They aren't professionals. When they are professionals then they can get paid. Apprentices go thru the same thing. College football is essentially an apprenticeship for the NFL. What about residencies for doctors? They are doing the same thing as full time MD's but aren't getting near the same compensation. Why shouldn't they just start taking medical supplies and sell them? They are driving the revenue for the hospital. So, yes it does happen in other avenues too. You do it and deal with it. Don't cheat and then whine like a little girl because the rules aren't fair. Life isn't fair. Wait 3 years and you will be fully compensated. Its not a difficult, or unusual concept.

Unless you're a surgeon, I'd imagine by hurting his hand severly enough to not be able to perform surgery. Players risk the ability lose millions every second spent on the field while a jersey with their name on it, sells millions, because of the skill they've shown.

I'd say those two avenues of "unfairness" are completely different.

Then pay high school players... same concept

[Malkamaniac]

Those highschool players do get paid. If they are good enough. Are we for a second not going to believe that those players aren't receiving benefits?

Those kids are given stuff from the time they are recruited or are good enough to be recruited, until they stop playing in the NFL.

If they weren't, we wouldn't hear about coaches going after kids in the 7th and 8th grade.

[Malkamaniac]

Just like Lebron, he was in high school, and he had a hummer. However, a single mother all of a sudden had enough money to give that to him as a "gift."

[Defence21]

I don't think they are immature or misinformed. If I draw 100,000 people to a stadium to watch me play and watch my jersey being sold for 100 bucks in the bookstore, and I see zero dollars of that, then its not surprising to see that I am going to try to get my own cut by selling memorabilia, or taking free cars, etc. I don't think they are victims either, because the rules are what the rules are, and they know they risk being kicked out of school as a result. But they're nothing more than free labor and a money making machine for deal old alma mater. The NCAA is a fraud.

Yea forget that free $60000 education that should teach them the skills they need to provide for their family for the rest of their lives. Its somehow unjust that they don't get paid after the free education, food, shelter, and extra on campus benefits he receives. Poor, poor kids. Oh, and this tool bag knew if he waited 3-4 years HE WOULD BE A MILLIONAIRE!!! Don't tell me that they are abused and taken adavantage of. Just because they choose not to take advantage of the compensation offered to them doesn't mean they should be able to take other, improper benefits.

Exactly! A pro career lasts only a short time, but the compensation they get in college -- often times a free ride for their tuition -- sets the foundation for life after football. There are millions of college students out there looking for any kind of scholarship they can get -- $50, $500, $5,000, etc -- yet these athletes are portrayed as victims for getting a free ride, yet not getting paid? Come on. If they work hard and do it right, they'll get paid more in their short NFL career than the normal college graduate would make in a lifetime. Soooo unfair.

[Malkamaniac]

They aren't victims. They understand the rules, and none of us can clearly imagine what it would be like to have that kind of stuff sitting in front of you.

We're all the broke college kids, jealous because they are getting hand outs and are now holding them to the fire because of what they're doing.

I think the ideals of the NCAA is flawed, I think that something should happen, and I don't feel bad when kids get kicked out of college for selling stuff, as that's the rules that are there, but I'm not going to pretend I care if they are making money in any way they can. I don't know their situation at all.

I do know however, that if I had my name on the back of a jersey, selling MILLIONS a year compared to the LOL60k free education for a gangster.

I'm getting the money any way I can and I be willing to bet anything, given the same situation, most of you would also.

[Defence21]

They aren't victims. They understand the rules, and none of us can clearly imagine what it would be like to have that kind of stuff sitting in front of you.

We're all the broke college kids, jealous because they are getting hand outs and are now holding them to the fire because of what they're doing.

I think the ideals of the NCAA is flawed, I think that something should happen, and I don't feel bad when kids get kicked out of college for selling stuff, as that's the rules that are there, but I'm not going to pretend I care if they are making money in any way they can. I don't know their situation at all.

I do know however, that if I had my name on the back of a jersey, selling MILLIONS a year compared to the LOL60k free education for a gangster.

I'm getting the money any way I can and I be willing to bet anything, given the same situation, most of you would also.

Actually, I wasn't a broke college kid -- not a rich college kid either -- but I worked enough in summers to have money throughout the year and enjoy myself. I'm not jealous in the least -- and if the gifts were handed to me, I'd be taking them too. But to suggest that athletes in college should be paid is ridiculous. They're getting paid: it's called a free ride to an education. If they can't see the value in that, then they shouldn't be in college in the first place.

[Malkamaniac]

They aren't victims. They understand the rules, and none of us can clearly imagine what it would be like to have that kind of stuff sitting in front of you.

We're all the broke college kids, jealous because they are getting hand outs and are now holding them to the fire because of what they're doing.

I think the ideals of the NCAA is flawed, I think that something should happen, and I don't feel bad when kids get kicked out of college for selling stuff, as that's the rules that are there, but I'm not going to pretend I care if they are making money in any way they can. I don't know their situation at all.

I do know however, that if I had my name on the back of a jersey, selling MILLIONS a year compared to the LOL60k free education for a gangster.

I'm getting the money any way I can and I be willing to bet anything, given the same situation, most of you would also.

Actually, I wasn't a broke college kid -- not a rich college kid either -- but I worked enough in summers to have money throughout the year and enjoy myself. I'm not jealous in the least -- and if the gifts were handed to me, I'd be taking them too. But to suggest that athletes in college should be paid is ridiculous. They're getting paid: it's called a free ride to an education. If they can't see the value in that, then they shouldn't be in college in the first place.

Most of them only go to college because the NCAA is the only reasonable route to go to get to the nfl. I'm glad you see the disconnect, considering most of these kids come from crime ridden impoverished homes who value money as the end all be all.