shafnutz05 wrote:don't really know how Gates drinks Red Stripe. That was the only swill they had down in Jamaica and it was absolutely disgusting.
I thought Gates was drinking a Sam Adams. He drank Red Stripe? Did nobody at that table actually drink a decent beer? You're at the frigging White House. They could probably find you any beer on the planet and stock it for your event, and these people are drinking Bud and Red Stripe?
Their choice of beers was stupid and unnecessary.
...You know, I was wrong to call their beer choice stupid. To make amends, I say we all meet up for beers ourselves. I'll bring the Anchor Steam.
shafnutz05 wrote:don't really know how Gates drinks Red Stripe. That was the only swill they had down in Jamaica and it was absolutely disgusting.
I thought Gates was drinking a Sam Adams. He drank Red Stripe? Did nobody at that table actually drink a decent beer? You're at the frigging White House. They could probably find you any beer on the planet and stock it for your event, and these people are drinking Bud and Red Stripe?
Lol that's what I am talking about! What crappy, crappy beers. They probably could have designed their own brew and had it made for them. I did think it was funny they were all drinking foreign beers...OBAMA HATES AMERICA!!!!!
i was fully expecting Obama to run to the local distributor, or six pack shop, or whatever they have in DC, with the media in tow, to pick out beer for the event. im somewhat dissappointed that didnt happen.
pittsoccer33 wrote:i was fully expecting Obama to run to the local distributor, or six pack shop, or whatever they have in DC, with the media in tow, to pick out beer for the event. im somewhat dissappointed that didnt happen.
He should have picked up a case of Colt 45 and two zigzags...now that would have been a roundtable worth attending
I believe that God created everything. Science is something, therefore God created science too. (Remember, that is my belief and the belief of at least 4 billion other people. The 4 billion is an estimate of Christians, Muslims and Jews in the world. All of whom believe in intelligent design. This does NOT mean that you HAVE to believe too.)
If god created everything, why is everything that god created gone? Is god indifferent to these things?About 98% of all species on planet earth have died away. Homo Sapiens got down to a few thousand, if we didn't move out of the heat of Africa we would have died out. If god's plan is to let everything die out, what kind of plan is that in the first place?
doublem wrote:If god created everything, why is everything that god created gone? Is god indifferent to these things?About 98% of all species on planet earth have died away. Homo Sapiens got down to a few thousand, if we didn't move out of the heat of Africa we would have died out. If god's plan is to let everything die out, what kind of plan is that in the first place?
Before I respond in full I want to clarify something. I assume you mean "Why are some things that God created gone?" and not 'everything'.
I believe that God created everything. Science is something, therefore God created science too. (Remember, that is my belief and the belief of at least 4 billion other people. The 4 billion is an estimate of Christians, Muslims and Jews in the world. All of whom believe in intelligent design. This does NOT mean that you HAVE to believe too.)
If god created everything, why is everything that god created gone? Is god indifferent to these things?About 98% of all species on planet earth have died away. Homo Sapiens got down to a few thousand, if we didn't move out of the heat of Africa we would have died out. If god's plan is to let everything die out, what kind of plan is that in the first place?
There was a term I learned a while back that I completely forgot. Basically, the principle is that God created the entire framework for the universe. As soon as he was finished doing that (with possible exceptions like the Great Flood, etc), he basically kicked back with a beer, turned on the HD, and watched the world unfold. I don't believe that God necessarily has to be constantly running around saving species/performing miracles/turning water into wine to be real. He is leaving us to our lives, and letting us make the decisions as we may. That's why there is crime, war, and other horrible things. I believe He is the creator of everything, but is now an inactive observer until we leave this mortal coil.
shafnutz05 wrote:There was a term I learned a while back that I completely forgot. Basically, the principle is that God created the entire framework for the universe. As soon as he was finished doing that (with possible exceptions like the Great Flood, etc), he basically kicked back with a beer, turned on the HD, and watched the world unfold. I don't believe that God necessarily has to be constantly running around saving species/performing miracles/turning water into wine to be real. He is leaving us to our lives, and letting us make the decisions as we may. That's why there is crime, war, and other horrible things. I believe He is the creator of everything, but is now an inactive observer until we leave this mortal coil.
I used to think that too. But God is omnipresent and is everywhere, all the time.
Again, these are my beliefs and I understand that not all people do or will believe the same.
doublem wrote:If god created everything, why is everything that god created gone? Is god indifferent to these things?About 98% of all species on planet earth have died away. Homo Sapiens got down to a few thousand, if we didn't move out of the heat of Africa we would have died out. If god's plan is to let everything die out, what kind of plan is that in the first place?
Before I respond in full I want to clarify something. I assume you mean "Why are some things that God created gone?" and not 'everything'.
I believe that God created everything. Science is something, therefore God created science too. (Remember, that is my belief and the belief of at least 4 billion other people. The 4 billion is an estimate of Christians, Muslims and Jews in the world. All of whom believe in intelligent design. This does NOT mean that you HAVE to believe too.)
If god created everything, why is everything that god created gone? Is god indifferent to these things?About 98% of all species on planet earth have died away. Homo Sapiens got down to a few thousand, if we didn't move out of the heat of Africa we would have died out. If god's plan is to let everything die out, what kind of plan is that in the first place?
There was a term I learned a while back that I completely forgot. Basically, the principle is that God created the entire framework for the universe. As soon as he was finished doing that (with possible exceptions like the Great Flood, etc), he basically kicked back with a beer, turned on the HD, and watched the world unfold. I don't believe that God necessarily has to be constantly running around saving species/performing miracles/turning water into wine to be real. He is leaving us to our lives, and letting us make the decisions as we may. That's why there is crime, war, and other horrible things. I believe He is the creator of everything, but is now an inactive observer until we leave this mortal coil.
Then you would be a deist? I guess. To me that seems pointless, if god is just a watchmaker, and he just set everything up, I don't understand the point of worshiping him becasue he is basically indifferent to the entire thing. It would seem if you believe that then god really has no plan for anything.
Last edited by doublem on Wed Sep 16, 2009 2:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
doublem wrote:If god created everything, why is everything that god created gone? Is god indifferent to these things?About 98% of all species on planet earth have died away. Homo Sapiens got down to a few thousand, if we didn't move out of the heat of Africa we would have died out. If god's plan is to let everything die out, what kind of plan is that in the first place?
Human beings are God's most prized creation. Everything else has been given to us to do with as we please (free will). He cares for humans above all other living things.
John 3:16
For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son that whoever believes in him will never die but have eternal life.
We believe that life goes on after physical death on this planet and that we will live forever with God in his new kingdom (heaven). Jesus Christ was his redemptive plan for us that we may be able to participate in this eternal life.
That is what we believe and I understand how hard it can be to grasp. It is by faith in which we (Chrisitians) live.
I'm not trying to convert you or save you. I'm not even capable of such things. Only God can do that work in you. I just want to present you with how we view life and death.
cs6687 wrote:
That's why I think most liberals aren't bright. They can't think for themselves and they support their cause without placing blame elsewhere.
Maybe you should read this book to help out in talking with crazy liberals: " onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
doublem wrote:Then you would be a deist? I guess. To me that seems pointless, if god is just a watchmaker, and he just set everything up, I don't understand the point of worshiping him becasue he is basically indifferent to the entire thing.
I mostly agree, although if you believe that you were created by someone then worshiping them would make sense.
But I don't believe He is just sitting up there doing nothing....
OK I guess the way I said that didn't come out too clearly, sorry. I don't believe that God is a completely inactive observer....my point was I don't need to see rainbows flying through the sky and lightning bolts coming down and killing blasphemers to believe that He is up there watching. Essentially, I guess I was just talking about the importance of faith, albeit in a completely nonsensical and inefficient way. I do believe in the power of prayer...some miracle cures are simply do unlikely and improbable to be anything but that. Some people would see it a different way. Sorry, that post didn't make any sense. I DO feel He has an active role in my life......but it's impossible to quantify. You dig?
doublem wrote:If god created everything, why is everything that god created gone? Is god indifferent to these things?About 98% of all species on planet earth have died away. Homo Sapiens got down to a few thousand, if we didn't move out of the heat of Africa we would have died out. If god's plan is to let everything die out, what kind of plan is that in the first place?
Human beings are God's most prized creation. Everything else has been given to us to do with as we please (free will). He cares for humans above all other living things.
John 3:16
For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son that whoever believes in him will never die but have eternal life.
We believe that life goes on after physical death on this planet and that we will live forever with God in his new kingdom (heaven). Jesus Christ was his redemptive plan for us that we may be able to participate in this eternal life.
That is what we believe and I understand how hard it can be to grasp. It is by faith in which we (Chrisitians) live.
I'm not trying to convert you or save you. I'm not even capable of such things. Only God can do that work in you. I just want to present you with how we view life and death.
I know that is the Christian message, but we almost died out as a species, what was god waiting for? If god loves us, and is omniscient, why would he make us so flawed that we will kill each other over things like belief in him? Why would god care about humans more then anything else on this planet? What makes us so special? I just have a hard time thinking that god would make man so flawed that it could result in our own deconstruction.
doublem wrote:Then you would be a deist? I guess. To me that seems pointless, if god is just a watchmaker, and he just set everything up, I don't understand the point of worshiping him becasue he is basically indifferent to the entire thing.
I mostly agree, although if you believe that you were created by someone then worshiping them would make sense.
But I don't believe He is just sitting up there doing nothing....
Not to me, you don't really worship your parents do you? You love them, but I don't say worship.
doublem wrote:Then you would be a deist? I guess. To me that seems pointless, if god is just a watchmaker, and he just set everything up, I don't understand the point of worshiping him becasue he is basically indifferent to the entire thing.
I mostly agree, although if you believe that you were created by someone then worshiping them would make sense.
But I don't believe He is just sitting up there doing nothing....
Not to me, you don't really worship your parents do you? You love them, but I don't say worship.
Ill answer this one first.
My parents did not create me. They combined some cells and then God gave me life. Again, this is my belief and I have faith in it.
doublem wrote:I know that is the Christian message, but we almost died out as a species, what was god waiting for? If god loves us, and is omniscient, why would he make us so flawed that we will kill each other over things like belief in him? Why would god care about humans more then anything else on this planet? What makes us so special? I just have a hard time thinking that god would make man so flawed that it could result in our own deconstruction.
This was my response to another post earlier that is a good answer to this...
When we were created, we were given free will. in use of our free will, we took a big ol bite out of death when we disobeyed God by eating of the forbidden fruit, thus inviting death and decay into our lives. This includes the decay of our human bodies-that begin to die from the day we are born.
God's plan was NOT for us to live in pain and suffering and death. We were created for fellowship with Him. We chose the path that we are on now.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- You've all done a tremendous job of keeping very sensitive subject discussion civil. Thank you.
I just want to remind you, that this is a political thread. PFIDC's views are shaped by his faith, which is why he references it in his reasoning.
I don't want to see this turn into a persecution of him for his beliefs, nor a bombardment of asking him to explain why/how the god that he believes in exists.
As long as everyone is comfortable discussing this, feel free to continue, but let's not turn this into a debate about whether or not god exists. We each have our religious beliefs, and this is a political thread.
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My computer was running so slow, by the time I replied to you in the chat, you had timed out.
I did...
and for everyone else here who could take this the wrong way, I didn't tattle tale on ANYONE. There is nothing I enjoy more on this earth then speaking about God to non-believers. I expressed my personal feelings about one of Dagny's posts to her directly. This is the chat reference that she made
