Formula 1 thread

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CBear3
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Re: Formula 1 thread

Post by CBear3 »

tifosi77 wrote:
CBear3 wrote:The Indycar thing is pure fantasy.
At this stage of my life, I tend to think this is the case generally.
My "what do you want to be if you grow up" answer was always the winner of the 100th running of the Indy 500.
The clock is almost officially up on that fantasy.
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Re: Formula 1 thread

Post by dodint »

I'd be a bigger fan of the Indy 500 if it werent' just another Indy race. It used to be an exhibition (before my time) and now it's the crown jewel in a series calendar.
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Re: Formula 1 thread

Post by tifosi77 »

CBear3 wrote:
tifosi77 wrote:
CBear3 wrote:The Indycar thing is pure fantasy.
At this stage of my life, I tend to think this is the case generally.
My "what do you want to be if you grow up" answer was always the winner of the 100th running of the Indy 500.
The clock is almost officially up on that fantasy.
:lol:
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Re: Formula 1 thread

Post by tifosi77 »

dodint wrote:I'd be a bigger fan of the Indy 500 if it werent' just another Indy race. It used to be an exhibition (before my time) and now it's the crown jewel in a series calendar.
The sad thing is that it was the perceived marginalization of the race that led FTG to break off after 1995.

By the time I had been following the sport for maybe ten years (early 90s) the need to have Indy be a month-long rigmarole was over. 'Carb Day'?? Really? It took a month to prepare for the '500 in the 1960s when the cars were still fairly fragile and primitive. But by the 90s, cars could race for 500 miles without too much fuss. There used to be three 500-milers on the CART calendar. Even now I think it's overly long at two weeks.
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Re: Formula 1 thread

Post by dodint »

I'm saying this as someone that is a budding Indy follower. I started DVR'ing two years ago as something to put on in the background/fall asleep to, but now I actually track the series. I wouldn't say I'm a fan, but I follow.
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Re: Formula 1 thread

Post by CBear3 »

tifosi77 wrote:
dodint wrote:I'd be a bigger fan of the Indy 500 if it werent' just another Indy race. It used to be an exhibition (before my time) and now it's the crown jewel in a series calendar.
The sad thing is that it was the perceived marginalization of the race that led FTG to break off after 1995.

By the time I had been following the sport for maybe ten years (early 90s) the need to have Indy be a month-long rigmarole was over. 'Carb Day'?? Really? It took a month to prepare for the '500 in the 1960s when the cars were still fairly fragile and primitive. But by the 90s, cars could race for 500 miles without too much fuss. There used to be three 500-milers on the CART calendar. Even now I think it's overly long at two weeks.
Blasphemy. Or not...
If the rules were still as open as they even were in the 90's, the "Month of May" would make sense. Before the IRL you very seldom had more than 5 or 6 cars on the lead lap, or more than 12-15 even finish. While that doesn't make for exciting drama, it was a by-product of having the regulations open enough that you really were walking a tightrope of finishing the race simply based on reliability. You had Indy only designs show up that used the whole month to work the bugs out.
Today, its basically a spec series and mechanical problems are practically non-existent. Everybody has the same equipment, it's basically the same as it was the year prior, there's no need to log metric crap-tons of miles.


But I'm biased. My first 500 I was 8 (1988). RV's were parked up on the old railroad tracks all the way back to the interstate, they'd all been drinking for a week, and I asked my dad why they were advertising "free oral mammograms." We didn't make it to his friends house near the track, had to park in a car wash. Walked through the neighborhood and all of a sudden rises a racetrack large enough to hold multiple Disney Worlds. We made it to our turn 4 seats just as Gomer was wrapping up "Back Home Again..." and I've been in love ever since.
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Re: Formula 1 thread

Post by tifosi77 »

If you have a smart TV with apps, or a Chromecast device, go to the YouTubes and watch old CART races from the 90s. For my money, that's the best motor racing that has ever existed. Variety of cars and tracks, 1,000 hp motors, 250 mph in the draft on superspeedways, talented drivers. It was great.
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Re: Formula 1 thread

Post by CBear3 »

Michigan Handford device races were "the best races nobody ever saw" we'd say. Had the suite at the T1 end of the pits, easily the best place in the infield. Met several Red Wings there, but my favorite was standing with Clint and Casey Mears as they gasp at the racing action, and then we had to break the news to them that they were just as scary in Lights the day before.
Elkhart Lake, Burke Airport, Nazareth, Portland, etc. So many great tracks that produced great racing that open wheelers don't go to anymore.
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Re: Formula 1 thread

Post by Shyster »

tifosi77 wrote:The sad thing is that it was the perceived marginalization of the race that led FTG to break off after 1995.
By the time I had been following the sport for maybe ten years (early 90s) the need to have Indy be a month-long rigmarole was over. 'Carb Day'?? Really? It took a month to prepare for the '500 in the 1960s when the cars were still fairly fragile and primitive. But by the 90s, cars could race for 500 miles without too much fuss. There used to be three 500-milers on the CART calendar. Even now I think it's overly long at two weeks.
The narrow rules these days have also eliminated much of the reason for the full month. Back in the day you could have cars with front engines, rear engines, gas engines, methanol engines, turbine engines, diesel engines, etc. with no fixed rules for chassis, wheelbase, min/max weight, fuel-tank size, and a host of other factors. From the book Black Noon it really struck me that every car was a work in progress and the teams were constantly rebuilding them over the month in the quest for more speed. For example, the book describes how Mickey Thompson's team was practically rebuilding its cars every single night, and many teams didn't pick their tires until right before the race. Today, we have one spec chassis, one tire supplier, and two engines that are also pretty limited by the rules. Teams can change their setups for the cars, but they can't really change the cars themselves all that much. And it doesn't take a month for an experienced team and driver to set up a race car.
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Re: Formula 1 thread

Post by tifosi77 »

This is legitimately stupid, but I can't stop watching it.

[youtube][/youtube]
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Re: Formula 1 thread

Post by dodint »

lol wtf
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Re: Formula 1 thread

Post by Sigwolf »

Race 2 of Formula E left me feeling much the same as race 1. It is not truly auto racing when the cars pull into the garage at the mid point to let the drivers get into a completely different car. It's a mildly interesting exhibition, but it's not really motorsport.

Have double-header races of a duration that allows for the battery capacity, or have cars that allow for battery pack swaps in a reasonable time, but this is ridiculous.
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Re: Formula 1 thread

Post by dodint »

Yeah, I say swap the battery even if it takes a while. As long as the procedure is the same for all teams it's fine.
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Re: Formula 1 thread

Post by tifosi77 »

Formula E is interesting, but ithe underscores the basic weak point of electric cars; batteries.

40 years ago in F1, drivers could switch cars mid-race. Fangio actually won a title because his teammate - whose name escapes me at the moment... Hawthorne?... - gave up his car so the Argentine could continue on after experiencing mechanical problems . This despite the fact that the English teammate was still in contention for the title.
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Re: Formula 1 thread

Post by columbia »

I'm not paying attention to it, but there's something relaxing about the variable whir of these F1 engines.
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Re: Formula 1 thread

Post by dodint »

It's soothing in the way that getting a fork caught in the garbage disposal is pleasant.
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Re: Formula 1 thread

Post by columbia »

I like white noise.
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Re: Formula 1 thread

Post by dodint »

There are a couple of race series that I DVR just to fall asleep to. DTM, for one. That's how I got into Indy, when it wasn't able to put me to sleep anymore I started watching it regularly.
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Re: Formula 1 thread

Post by tifosi77 »

columbia wrote:I'm not paying attention to it, but there's something relaxing about the variable whir of these F1 engines.
Yeah, that's the problem.

F1 engines - even back in the low-fi days of the 60s and 70s - always sounded like they were just this side of tearing themselves apart. The current breed isn't even revving to the maximum RPM allowed by the regs because of fuel flow rate limitations. The tech behind the motors is pretty cool But the rules for using them are completely stupid.
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Re: Formula 1 thread

Post by tifosi77 »

Congrats to
Spoiler:
Lewis. It simply would have been wrong for a driver who more than doubled up his closest rival's win total to not take home the bacon. Honestly, I'd be happy if the champion was crowned based solely on wins, and things like prize money apportioned on finishing order. It's all about the Ws.
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Re: Formula 1 thread

Post by dodint »

That title is slightly more valid than Buttons only because there was some competition within the team. ;)
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Re: Formula 1 thread

Post by tifosi77 »

So double points and standing re-starts are off the menu for 2015. The people running the sport clearly have no idea what they are doing. Both of those things were immensely unpopular among fans, and I'm glad they're gone. But introducing them and rescinding them all in the space of one year makes them look clueless.
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Re: Formula 1 thread

Post by dodint »

Image
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Re: Formula 1 thread

Post by MRandall25 »

tifosi77 wrote:So double points and standing re-starts are off the menu for 2015. The people running the sport clearly have no idea what they are doing. Both of those things were immensely unpopular among fans, and I'm glad they're gone. But introducing them and rescinding them all in the space of one year makes them look clueless.
They don't really have a preseason where they can test rule changes out to see if the changes make sense.
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Re: Formula 1 thread

Post by tifosi77 »

Yeah, but in the case of the standing re-starts they didn't even make it to the season they were supposed to take effect. And I don't think it takes tweaking and refinement to understand that double points and standing re-starts were just stupid ideas.