Random Penguins Fodder

[thehockeyguru]

Saw an article today that said the Leafs are the top destination for DeBrusk. He is going to get paid and likely overpaid

I'll widen my list of off-season targets a bit. Choose 1 from column A, 1 from B, and 1 from C:

A) "The center" Pinto, Sissons, Roslovic, Stenlund
B) "The grittier top 6er" DeBrusk, Bertuzzi, Mantha, someone via trade
C) "The grittier bottom 6er" Duhaime, Joshua, McBain, Frederic, Lomberg

Does that change if they move Malkin to LW? If you move Malkin to LW would it be on Sid's line or the 2nd line?

[FLPensFan]

Saw an article today that said the Leafs are the top destination for DeBrusk. He is going to get paid and likely overpaid

I'll widen my list of off-season targets a bit. Choose 1 from column A, 1 from B, and 1 from C:

A) "The center" Pinto, Sissons, Roslovic, Stenlund
B) "The grittier top 6er" DeBrusk, Bertuzzi, Mantha, someone via trade
C) "The grittier bottom 6er" Duhaime, Joshua, McBain, Frederic, Lomberg

Does that change if they move Malkin to LW? If you move Malkin to LW would it be on Sid's line or the 2nd line?

It would have to change because if Malkin were to move to wing, we'd have no 2C. I think Pinto can potentially be that guy in another year or two, but not this season. If Malkin were to move to wing, then they need to target someone as a 2C. Seems harder to pull off. I thought of Stamkos if TB can't sign him, but I think at 34 he played mostly LW last year. Harder to play center at that age.

[FLPensFan]

Yager's Moose Jaw team lost 5-4 to Saginaw, but Yager had a big game according to Taylor Haase. Moose Jaw was down 4-0, outshot 25-9 midway through the game. Yager scored the first and 3rd goals for Moose Jaw, had an assist on a Firkus goal that was called back, and was named player of the game in a losing effort.

Moose Jaw's next game is Monday against London

While many experts say Yager is still a year or two away, size and playing against bigger competition one thing that will hold him back...he is the only Penguin property who is having a chance to "seize the moment" to put himself in a position for a roster spot this fall. With WBS getting eliminated early, nobody else got that opportunity. Yager has been impressive, he's been working with Cullen on faceoffs, he's improved with and without the puck. He keeps this up, he may force Pittsburgh to at least give him a 9 game tryout.

[thehockeyguru]

The key to this off-season for me is getting Smith off the books. If you had to guess, what do you think happens with him?

A. He's traded at some point from now through the end of the draft.
B. He's traded after the draft but before the start of free agency
C. He's traded after the start of free agency but before opening night.
D. He's in the opening night lineup.

[Ohio_Pens_fan]

A

[Ericf]

The key to this off-season for me is getting Smith off the books. If you had to guess, what do you think happens with him?

A. He's traded at some point from now through the end of the draft.
B. He's traded after the draft but before the start of free agency
C. He's traded after the start of free agency but before opening night.
D. He's in the opening night lineup.

I would hope B. He’s not a priority player so I doubt A. More realistically C: teams with winger interest are likely to see what happens at the draft and on July 1 before deciding whether it makes sense to trade for him and how much money they have (or if they need retention or to trade another player’s contract depending on what happens with free agency).

[Ericf]

Delete

[Puck-Lurker]

The key to this off-season for me is getting Smith off the books. If you had to guess, what do you think happens with him?

A. He's traded at some point from now through the end of the draft.
B. He's traded after the draft but before the start of free agency
C. He's traded after the start of free agency but before opening night.
D. He's in the opening night lineup.

D.

Wouldn't be what I'd like, but I think that's most likely. Just going with the most depressing option to suit the trend.

[FLPensFan]

The key to this off-season for me is getting Smith off the books. If you had to guess, what do you think happens with him?

A. He's traded at some point from now through the end of the draft.
B. He's traded after the draft but before the start of free agency
C. He's traded after the start of free agency but before opening night.
D. He's in the opening night lineup.

D.

Wouldn't be what I'd like, but I think that's most likely. Just going with the most depressing option to suit the trend.

I'm going with A or B. Ideally, I'd like to see him dealt at the draft for a pick and a prospect, with no retention. Clear his cap and make room for something else. I don't think that is entirely far-fetched. He didn't have a strong year last year, but teams don't look at the most current season in a vacuum to make their decisions. He's known as a fairly strong playoff performer. Outside of last year, his last real down year was 16-17 with Florida.

If somehow A doesn't happen, then we trade him after the draft. I'm not sure if Smith is a big enough piece to package a solid prospect and a pick with to get a good young player, but, I expect Dubas to make a run at doing that somehow. He specifically called it out in the Guentzel trade that, he had other moves that he wanted to make, but teams wanted prospects coming back and the Penguins didn't have the pool to do it. Now adding Ponomarev, Koivunen, and Lucius, Dubas can like add a Poulin or Ponomarev to a deal to get a better player.

Whatever happens this summer, Dubas can't miss like last year. Solid A+'s for Eller and Nedeljokovic, but pretty much solid Fs for Acciari, Nieto, and Graves...and the huge contract on Graves could sting for years.

Dubas is already under the hotseat for me. He needs to fix it this offseason.

[Ericf]

The key to this off-season for me is getting Smith off the books. If you had to guess, what do you think happens with him?

A. He's traded at some point from now through the end of the draft.
B. He's traded after the draft but before the start of free agency
C. He's traded after the start of free agency but before opening night.
D. He's in the opening night lineup.

D.

Wouldn't be what I'd like, but I think that's most likely. Just going with the most depressing option to suit the trend.

I'm going with A or B. Ideally, I'd like to see him dealt at the draft for a pick and a prospect, with no retention. Clear his cap and make room for something else. I don't think that is entirely far-fetched. He didn't have a strong year last year, but teams don't look at the most current season in a vacuum to make their decisions. He's known as a fairly strong playoff performer. Outside of last year, his last real down year was 16-17 with Florida.

If somehow A doesn't happen, then we trade him after the draft. I'm not sure if Smith is a big enough piece to package a solid prospect and a pick with to get a good young player, but, I expect Dubas to make a run at doing that somehow. He specifically called it out in the Guentzel trade that, he had other moves that he wanted to make, but teams wanted prospects coming back and the Penguins didn't have the pool to do it. Now adding Ponomarev, Koivunen, and Lucius, Dubas can like add a Poulin or Ponomarev to a deal to get a better player.

Whatever happens this summer, Dubas can't miss like last year. Solid A+'s for Eller and Nedeljokovic, but pretty much solid Fs for Acciari, Nieto, and Graves...and the huge contract on Graves could sting for years.

Dubas is already under the hotseat for me. He needs to fix it this offseason.

You forgot re-signing Jarry — big F

[FLPensFan]

The key to this off-season for me is getting Smith off the books. If you had to guess, what do you think happens with him?

A. He's traded at some point from now through the end of the draft.
B. He's traded after the draft but before the start of free agency
C. He's traded after the start of free agency but before opening night.
D. He's in the opening night lineup.

D.

Wouldn't be what I'd like, but I think that's most likely. Just going with the most depressing option to suit the trend.

I'm going with A or B. Ideally, I'd like to see him dealt at the draft for a pick and a prospect, with no retention. Clear his cap and make room for something else. I don't think that is entirely far-fetched. He didn't have a strong year last year, but teams don't look at the most current season in a vacuum to make their decisions. He's known as a fairly strong playoff performer. Outside of last year, his last real down year was 16-17 with Florida.

If somehow A doesn't happen, then we trade him after the draft. I'm not sure if Smith is a big enough piece to package a solid prospect and a pick with to get a good young player, but, I expect Dubas to make a run at doing that somehow. He specifically called it out in the Guentzel trade that, he had other moves that he wanted to make, but teams wanted prospects coming back and the Penguins didn't have the pool to do it. Now adding Ponomarev, Koivunen, and Lucius, Dubas can like add a Poulin or Ponomarev to a deal to get a better player.

Whatever happens this summer, Dubas can't miss like last year. Solid A+'s for Eller and Nedeljokovic, but pretty much solid Fs for Acciari, Nieto, and Graves...and the huge contract on Graves could sting for years.

Dubas is already under the hotseat for me. He needs to fix it this offseason.

You forgot re-signing Jarry — big F

I wouldn't give that an F. I don't give it a great grade, but probably a C-. I don't like the term or the $$$$, but there weren't much other options. Jarry didn't play horrible this year...but, he played about the same, and had the same issues as last year. Hurt or unreliable down the stretch.

[thehockeyguru]

The key to this off-season for me is getting Smith off the books. If you had to guess, what do you think happens with him?

A. He's traded at some point from now through the end of the draft.
B. He's traded after the draft but before the start of free agency
C. He's traded after the start of free agency but before opening night.
D. He's in the opening night lineup.

I would hope B. He’s not a priority player so I doubt A. More realistically C: teams with winger interest are likely to see what happens at the draft and on July 1 before deciding whether it makes sense to trade for him and how much money they have (or if they need retention or to trade another player’s contract depending on what happens with free agency).

Nashville is a team with a lot of cap space and Smith fits the Trots mold. I wonder if there is a fit there if Nashville misses on the bigger fish

[FLPensFan]

The key to this off-season for me is getting Smith off the books. If you had to guess, what do you think happens with him?

A. He's traded at some point from now through the end of the draft.
B. He's traded after the draft but before the start of free agency
C. He's traded after the start of free agency but before opening night.
D. He's in the opening night lineup.

I would hope B. He’s not a priority player so I doubt A. More realistically C: teams with winger interest are likely to see what happens at the draft and on July 1 before deciding whether it makes sense to trade for him and how much money they have (or if they need retention or to trade another player’s contract depending on what happens with free agency).

Nashville is a team with a lot of cap space and Smith fits the Trots mold. I wonder if there is a fit there if Nashville misses on the bigger fish

Well, if Pinto isn't available or is too expensive, even though he'll be 31 in November, Sissons was my second choice for a 3C add. Good on faceoffs, 15 goal, 35 point guy, right handed, 137 hits last year would be tied with Letang for the most on the Penguins. Sissons has this coming season and one more on his deal.

I'd gladly do Smith with 20% retained for Sissons. Puts the salaries at about even.

[thehockeyguru]

The key to this off-season for me is getting Smith off the books. If you had to guess, what do you think happens with him?

A. He's traded at some point from now through the end of the draft.
B. He's traded after the draft but before the start of free agency
C. He's traded after the start of free agency but before opening night.
D. He's in the opening night lineup.

I would hope B. He’s not a priority player so I doubt A. More realistically C: teams with winger interest are likely to see what happens at the draft and on July 1 before deciding whether it makes sense to trade for him and how much money they have (or if they need retention or to trade another player’s contract depending on what happens with free agency).

Nashville is a team with a lot of cap space and Smith fits the Trots mold. I wonder if there is a fit there if Nashville misses on the bigger fish

Well, if Pinto isn't available or is too expensive, even though he'll be 31 in November, Sissons was my second choice for a 3C add. Good on faceoffs, 15 goal, 35 point guy, right handed, 137 hits last year would be tied with Letang for the most on the Penguins. Sissons has this coming season and one more on his deal.

I'd gladly do Smith with 20% retained for Sissons. Puts the salaries at about even.

That would be an interesting trade, I like Sissons. I don't know if that would be enough since there is a premium to acquire RH centers.

Sissons at 3C and Eller at 4C would be a much better deeper bottom 6

[Wyopen]

Let’s be honest here, I’ve also heard podcasts express that we should go after Neccas and Ullmark, really? What assets do we have that would make teams want to trade with us? Any other interested team can outbid us. Outside of MP28, there’s no one. What could we offer Ottawa to get Pinto?

[FLPensFan]

The key to this off-season for me is getting Smith off the books. If you had to guess, what do you think happens with him?

A. He's traded at some point from now through the end of the draft.
B. He's traded after the draft but before the start of free agency
C. He's traded after the start of free agency but before opening night.
D. He's in the opening night lineup.

I would hope B. He’s not a priority player so I doubt A. More realistically C: teams with winger interest are likely to see what happens at the draft and on July 1 before deciding whether it makes sense to trade for him and how much money they have (or if they need retention or to trade another player’s contract depending on what happens with free agency).

Nashville is a team with a lot of cap space and Smith fits the Trots mold. I wonder if there is a fit there if Nashville misses on the bigger fish

Well, if Pinto isn't available or is too expensive, even though he'll be 31 in November, Sissons was my second choice for a 3C add. Good on faceoffs, 15 goal, 35 point guy, right handed, 137 hits last year would be tied with Letang for the most on the Penguins. Sissons has this coming season and one more on his deal.

I'd gladly do Smith with 20% retained for Sissons. Puts the salaries at about even.

That would be an interesting trade, I like Sissons. I don't know if that would be enough since there is a premium to acquire RH centers.

Sissons at 3C and Eller at 4C would be a much better deeper bottom 6

And this is how the Penguins need to start thinking. Not "Eller did great for us at 3C, he needs to stay there," but rather "Eller at 4C gives us much more depth and flexibility." Depth is an issue. Keeping Eller at 3C and getting a dime a dozen 4C or letting a Poulin/Gruden/Ponamarev handle that role off the bat isn't ideal. Yes, I want young guys in the lineup. But those young guys need to be put in the right slots.

This team needs to go back to have an identity to its 3rd and 4th line...not just a mismatch of random parts thrown together. I want to see a 3C that plays good defense and can score some goals to help out the top 6. I want to see an energy/defensive 4th line. Go get Duhaime and Lomberg and throw Eller in between those guys on the 4th line. Eller will get his shot to move up to 3C as injuries occur or as cold streaks happen.

[FLPensFan]

Let’s be honest here, I’ve also heard podcasts express that we should go after Neccas and Ullmark, really? What assets do we have that would make teams want to trade with us? Any other interested team can outbid us. Outside of MP28, there’s no one. What could we offer Ottawa to get Pinto?

I'd offer them Sergei Murashov and a 2nd/3rd and see what that gets. Ottawa has no solid goaltending. Korpisalo is 30 and was less than stellar as a full time starter. Mads Sogaard is their best goalie prospect. He's 6'8" and 23 years old, and across 3 years, he's played 27 games in the NHL, gone 10-10-3 with a 3.44 GAA and .884 SV%.

Russian goaltending prospects are a hot commodity, after seeing the likes of Shesterkin and Sorokin come in and play well, plus Vasilevskiy and other solid Russian goalies. Murashov has been called the best goalie prospect outside the NHL at times. Sell high.

And if that doesn't work, offer them Yager straight up. Everyone wants to see this guy in a Penguin uniform. So do I, but on the flip side, he's not Gretzky, Lemieux, or Crosby. He may end up a very, very good player in the NHL...or his success at the WHL level could not translate as well at the NHL level and he becomes a 3rd liner. We don't know. And for the state the Penguins are in now, I'm ok with trading a 19 year old Yager for a 23 year old Pinto. It would be different if you asked me to dump Yager for a 28-32 year old player who has peaked.

[Wyopen]

Pinto could be a crap shoot also. Who’s to say his “success” with Ottawa will translate to a Penguins success, especially with Sullivan. I think we could get a better return for Yager, if we trade him. Smith, Graves, et al didn’t work out even though they were good for other teams. Pinto won’t put us over the top. We need to build our farm system not trade it or picks away.

[FLPensFan]

Pinto could be a crap shoot also. Who’s to say his “success” with Ottawa will translate to a Penguins success, especially with Sullivan. I think we could get a better return for Yager, if we trade him. Smith, Graves, et al didn’t work out even though they were good for other teams. Pinto won’t put us over the top. We need to build our farm system not trade it or picks away.

Who's to say Yager's success in the WHL translates to success as a Penguin, especially with Sullivan. Unless Yager is viewed as a can't miss 1st line prospect, 90% of the time I'm going to take the under 24 year old player who has already shown NHL success. The NHL draft odds are just too low. That doesn't mean I'm down on Yager at all. It just means if the Penguins think a young 3C (who could become a 2C) is more important now...I don't have a problem with making that deal.

We do need to build our farm system, but, as long as Crosby, Malkin, and Letang are here, nobody being added to our prospect pool right now is going to be the wave of the future.

If Sid signs a 3 year extension, it's 4 years before the core (some or all) are gone. 3-4 years left of the core doing whatever, then add probably at least 3 years of drafting in the top 10, and another 2-3 years for those players to age and grow their skillset.

[Wyopen]

So in reality regardless of either choice, we’re going to tread water. This loyalty to the core is another issue. It’s apparent you like Pinto and I like Yager. But that’s ok. If we were a team close to a Stanley cup, I could be on the Pinto train. Best regards!

[FLPensFan]

So in reality regardless of either choice, we’re going to tread water. This loyalty to the core is another issue. It’s apparent you like Pinto and I like Yager. But that’s ok. If we were a team close to a Stanley cup, I could be on the Pinto train. Best regards!

I keep repeating Pinto because the number of right handed centers around the league is very low. Like, lower than the number of quality RH RD. If we are going to improve there, I'd prefer one that is younger. Sissons from Nashville would be a fine backup choice.

I agree about the core loyalty, but that isn't going to change. I need to see this team hit on more of their moves this offseason, or at least, if they flameout, they shouldn't be a miss from Day 1.

Find an under 30 forward out there that is better than what we have today.
Add some grit up and down the lineup.
Build a purpose for the 3C and 4C, preferably secondary scoring but defensively capable 3rd line, with a defensively capable but energy 4th line.

DeBrusk-Crosby-Rust
Bunting-Malkin-Rakell
DOC-Pinto-Puustinen
Duhaime-Eller-Lomberg
x-Poulin, Puljujarvi

Something like that would give me some hope that, if this team actually made the playoffs again, we would have some guys that would go to the net and wouldn't crumble to IR at the first big check.

[Wyopen]

I must admit I like that lineup! I’m not against Pinto, I just don’t like Yager traded. I’m not a prognosticator, but I can see if we flame out the next complaint is we have no one in the farm system. And Yager is our best prospect.

[FLPensFan]

I must admit I like that lineup! I’m not against Pinto, I just don’t like Yager traded. I’m not a prognosticator, but I can see if we flame out the next complaint is we have no one in the farm system. And Yager is our best prospect.

Yeah, and trust me, I'm not wanting to get rid of Yager. But to get a good resource, you have to give up something good. And Ottawa is stacked at LD so Pickering isn't going to cut it. Maybe Yager or Murashov would do it. Maybe they'd take Ponomarev/Poulin and a high pick, but that seems like wishful thinking.

[BigMcK]

"Pinto's camp is reportedly seeking something in the range of $5 million AAV, but the Senators are offering nowhere close to that."

"Ideally, both sides would like to get a long-term deal in the five-to-six-year range in place. Postmedia has been told the two sides have a fairly wide gap to close if that’s going to happen."

"It's still hard to project his future value with only one full season and another half a year under his belt. And Pinto does not own arbitration rights. This might be the sort of situation where a bridge deal might be in order, 2-3 years, so that he can just get in camp with a contract (unlike last year) and both sides can assess better where they are in 2026 or '27, and a proper long-term extension can be discussed at that point. "

Limp factor in a trade for Yagger, straight up, is limp. Let the core move on, stockpile picks and youth, and stop mortgaging the future on failed system players who never excell under small, non-existent coaches. Enough already.

No. We will not kick the can down the road.

[Pens4Life]

I think some critics are too harsh on Dubas.. seems like you guys are excusing Sullivan now thru that!?

Dubas to get F for Acciari, Nieto, Graves? Come on.. Acciari wasnt bad this season, he was solid (almost every game I watched he was noticable for hustle,energy, defensive plays) just missused by Sullivan at C, Nieto barely played 20 games, he didnt find the rythm yet in that span, but you cant even grade that..
Graves was bad,really bad - but who would say he would be that lost and horrible based on previous seasons? Maybe 1 out of 1000! Cant put that on Dubas again! Also lets stop pretending that majority of moves werent dictated by Sullivan too,as he is GM lite..

About trading young guys for some probable targets to improve team, Im pretty much against it.. improve thru trading players that dont fit, vets and FA

Yager, Koivunen, Poulin, Blomquist, Murashev should be untouchable for now, maybe Ponomarev as well..