Random Penguins Fodder

[KG]

DK on his podcast this morning talked about trading Jarry and trading him now, while his value is at it's height.

I would definitely do it, assuming we can get a decent package in return. He also said he would try to sign Jake for a 5 year deal in the $8mill AAV range. I think if that's all Jake wanted, then he would have already been signed DK.

Jake is going to want longer term and more dollars than that and he deserves it.

[pens_CT]

DK on his podcast this morning talked about trading Jarry and trading him now, while his value is at it's height.

I would definitely do it, assuming we can get a decent package in return. He also said he would try to sign Jake for a 5 year deal in the $8mill AAV range. I think if that's all Jake wanted, then he would have already been signed DK.

Jake is going to want longer term and more dollars than that and he deserves it.

I think DK has been in denial over Jake since the beginning. Going back a few weeks ago his comments were along the lines "you can't trade the best wing that Crosby has ever had", now he's shifting to re-signing him at some low dollar figure & term. I think Jake gets probably 6 years minimum, and the AAV starts with a 9. Hopefully they can trade him for a couple of prospects that can become important pieces to this franchise in a couple of years. That's probably the best case scenario.

Regarding Jarry, if you can get a good offer, then go ahead and trade him. Hopefully the combination of Blomqvist and Ned will be acceptable going forward.

[penny lane]

I can't move past Jarry needing to beat Chicago last year for playoff spot. Can't take another year wondering about Jarry and how he will perform in the playoffs.

[lemieuxReturns]

I can't move past Jarry needing to beat Chicago last year for playoff spot. Can't take another year wondering about Jarry and how he will perform in the playoffs.

I agree. In a way, I thought Jarry had the upper hand this summer. There were not a lot of options in the UFA pool for a goalie and the Pens had big plans to still compete (trading for EK). Now that it is obvious that a rebuild is here, I think if you can get a big enough return you trade Jarry.

[thehockeyguru]

DK on his podcast this morning talked about trading Jarry and trading him now, while his value is at it's height.

I would definitely do it, assuming we can get a decent package in return. He also said he would try to sign Jake for a 5 year deal in the $8mill AAV range. I think if that's all Jake wanted, then he would have already been signed DK.

Jake is going to want longer term and more dollars than that and he deserves it.

I think DK has been in denial over Jake since the beginning. Going back a few weeks ago his comments were along the lines "you can't trade the best wing that Crosby has ever had", now he's shifting to re-signing him at some low dollar figure & term. I think Jake gets probably 6 years minimum, and the AAV starts with a 9. Hopefully they can trade him for a couple of prospects that can become important pieces to this franchise in a couple of years. That's probably the best case scenario.

Regarding Jarry, if you can get a good offer, then go ahead and trade him. Hopefully the combination of Blomqvist and Ned will be acceptable going forward.

Goaltending is cyclical and there is zero guarantee we see the same Ned next season. Ned was awesome to start in CAR then was basically traded to Detroit for nothing. He played a good season in Detroit then really fell off, Detroit let him walk for nothing.

I originally was in the sign Ned camp but I now think you have to trade Ned if someone gives you a pick for him .

[Guinness]

Sullivan will likely find the same "success" that Byslma did when he was canned. He was barely average before coming here, struck lightning in a bottle for a year and a half, and has been a regular season wonder at best for seven years since. Someone will snap him up, sure, and he will fade into obscurity just like Bylsma did.

Everyone was quick to acknowledge Matt Murray was a matter of "right place, right time", and the team quickly moved on. Sullivan was the exact same situation at the exact same time, yet the organization refuses to move on despite all evidence.

This is a team with several generational talents, that spends to the cap every year... yet they will have one playoff series win in seven years, none in the last six, and two straight years out of the playoffs altogether.

Sullivan is not special. Sullivan is doing nothing for this team. They need to move on.

Whether or not Sully will follow the same path as Disco is immaterial to me. 2 years of missing the playoffs, preceded by 4 years without a second round berth, preceded by a 2nd round ouster should be MORE than enough to get canned in the NHL, especially when your roster includes 2 generational talents, and, while not always the best supporting cast, still mostly a decent crop of players.

Bottom line - 1 playoff round win since 2017. That's it. You give him 2018, and MAYBE even 2-3 years after that, but that's it. We're easily 3-4 years past his expiration date. GMKD has had more than enough time to evaluate his performance. I know what he said at his last presser, but it should NOT be acceptable to have that kind of post-season record and still have a job.

Time to go, man. Thanks for what ya did. Hell, I'll even stand and clap for him when he comes back to town with whatever teams he lands with... but it's time for us to move on.

[BfromD]

Sell anyone and anything you can that isn't named Crosby.

Clean house behind the bench in the offseason.

Get the marketing team to work up a bunch of "Sid and the Kids" collateral and ride his last years trying something different if nothing else.

[Pitts]

Kingerski has a nice little wrap up of Dubas' apparent failures this season: https://pittsburghhockeynow.com/pittsbu ... bass-plan/

[lemieuxReturns]

Sell anyone and anything you can that isn't named Crosby.

Clean house behind the bench in the offseason.

Get the marketing team to work up a bunch of "Sid and the Kids" collateral and ride his last years trying something different if nothing else.

https://open.ai/images/V2e7P7e6LjooYfX_1

[BfromD]

Sell anyone and anything you can that isn't named Crosby.

Clean house behind the bench in the offseason.

Get the marketing team to work up a bunch of "Sid and the Kids" collateral and ride his last years trying something different if nothing else.

https://open.ai/images/V2e7P7e6LjooYfX_1

MOAR PLEASE

[KG]

Kingerski has a nice little wrap up of Dubas' apparent failures this season: https://pittsburghhockeynow.com/pittsbu ... bass-plan/

To me, the only real viable option was to make a coaching change early in the season, but I don't know if FSG would have been on board with that. Most teams do get a the bounce from a coaching change. That little bounce was probably all that would have been needed to get into the playoffs.

It's real hard to make legit trades in the regular season in the a flat cap. Basically dollar in dollar out and 3 team trades for retention purposes. I think we will see him re-tool by Friday and clear as much cap space he can for the summer. Bring in some younger skilled players, and for the love of god, bring in a new coaching staff.

[FLPensFan]

"I started to see certain things I value as a team that wasn’t changing, but then you saw a change. You saw the good games, you saw the details in some of the way we played, and then you wouldn’t see it in the next game. The inconsistency started to creep up and this was the final straw that broke the camel’s back for me, where I felt I needed to make the change."

That's Tom Fitzgerald talking about why he fired Ruff. Sounds like it fits another situation to a T.

[largegarlic]

Kingerski has a nice little wrap up of Dubas' apparent failures this season: https://pittsburghhockeynow.com/pittsbu ... bass-plan/

To me, the only real viable option was to make a coaching change early in the season, but I don't know if FSG would have been on board with that. Most teams do get a the bounce from a coaching change. That little bounce was probably all that would have been needed to get into the playoffs.

It's real hard to make legit trades in the regular season in the a flat cap. Basically dollar in dollar out and 3 team trades for retention purposes. I think we will see him re-tool by Friday and clear as much cap space he can for the summer. Bring in some younger skilled players, and for the love of god, bring in a new coaching staff.

I agree. I can see how needle-moving trades earlier in the season just won't come together. But the lack of coaching change is still bizarre. I don't think the Isles will ultimately make the playoffs either, but they're more in the hunt than the Pens are with a less talented roster after a coaching change.

[thehockeyguru]

I didn't put much credence in this thinking that JR probably isn't connected to the Pens organization but with how the team quit in Edmonton it now isn't so farfetched

"The rumor over the weekend through maybe people in the know or people, but I'm around a lot of people that are around the National Hockey League. Some of the players are starting to turn on Mike Sullivan. They are starting to lose faith and lose interest in Mike Sullivan. Maybe that is a big decision that Pittsburgh has to make."

via Jeremy Roenick, Snipes and Stripes

[FLPensFan]

I didn't put much credence in this thinking that JR probably isn't connected to the Pens organization but with how the team quit in Edmonton it now isn't so farfetched

"The rumor over the weekend through maybe people in the know or people, but I'm around a lot of people that are around the National Hockey League. Some of the players are starting to turn on Mike Sullivan. They are starting to lose faith and lose interest in Mike Sullivan. Maybe that is a big decision that Pittsburgh has to make."

via Jeremy Roenick, Snipes and Stripes

Yeah, I listened to this on his podcast the other day when a writer pointed it out. Honestly, it's very easy to see. This team has been completely inconsistent for 2 years. The PP has stunk and hit rock bottom this year. But even more than that, they have a hard time looking like an NHL hockey team on a consistent basis. They'll play a great game like they did against Vancouver, and two days later it's back to blown coverages, bad pinches, 2-1's galore.

The team has either tuned him out, can't execute, or Sully's tired, cliche "words of wisdom" after a loss have no effect on the team.

[maopens]

I didn't put much credence in this thinking that JR probably isn't connected to the Pens organization but with how the team quit in Edmonton it now isn't so farfetched

"The rumor over the weekend through maybe people in the know or people, but I'm around a lot of people that are around the National Hockey League. Some of the players are starting to turn on Mike Sullivan. They are starting to lose faith and lose interest in Mike Sullivan. Maybe that is a big decision that Pittsburgh has to make."

via Jeremy Roenick, Snipes and Stripes

Yeah, I listened to this on his podcast the other day when a writer pointed it out. Honestly, it's very easy to see. This team has been completely inconsistent for 2 years. The PP has stunk and hit rock bottom this year. But even more than that, they have a hard time looking like an NHL hockey team on a consistent basis. They'll play a great game like they did against Vancouver, and two days later it's back to blown coverages, bad pinches, 2-1's galore.

The team has either tuned him out, can't execute, or Sully's tired, cliche "words of wisdom" after a loss have no effect on the team.

I've thought the signs were there all season. Some of the new guys have openly expressed their frustrations at times. Lars Eller hasn't exactly hidden in his locker in post-game interviews. Also, I remember Karlsson being asked earlier this year about what can help the power play - he responded with something like "I have my thoughts on it but I'll keep those to myself". Not exactly a ringing endorsement from within that room.

All season, all last season, I see a team who cannot figure out zone entries with possession so they just dunp and chase to fight board battles - with a roster not built to win a lot of board battles -then endlessly push the puck around the boards with their backs to the net, zero threat to score. Very few opportunities between the circles from this team as opposed to how many shots they give up in that area. Cycle around the boards until someone can throw a wrister from 35 feet and nobody in front of the net to screen a goalie. Is it any wonder why they cannot score goals?

So, why have they not employed anything different? How can a team with Crosby, Malkin, Karlsson struggle every game to make zone entries with a man advantage? How can no member of that coaching staff come up with a way for these players to succeed, to maintain possession, even when on the man advantage? It's maddening to watch the same thing, night after night after night with nothing different.

How can any player in that locker room not tune out what is not working but still mandated???????

[DelPen]

"I started to see certain things I value as a team that wasn’t changing, but then you saw a change. You saw the good games, you saw the details in some of the way we played, and then you wouldn’t see it in the next game. The inconsistency started to creep up and this was the final straw that broke the camel’s back for me, where I felt I needed to make the change."

That's Tom Fitzgerald talking about why he fired Ruff. Sounds like it fits another situation to a T.

It’s why Bylsma was eventually fired despite always making the playoffs. It’s why Johnson was fired too. Yet Sullivan couldn’t get the players on the ice to win one game against the two worst teams in the NHL to miss them the first time in forever and the issues that caused them to miss last year are even worse this year despite a new GM and another year of massive roster turnover.

It’s insane that Sullivan was even extended after the constant playoff failure and even more crazy he wasn’t fired last year with Hextall. To not do it after another year of failure is negligence by FSG.

[IntangibleBeer]

Sullivan will likely find the same "success" that Byslma did when he was canned. He was barely average before coming here, struck lightning in a bottle for a year and a half, and has been a regular season wonder at best for seven years since. Someone will snap him up, sure, and he will fade into obscurity just like Bylsma did.

Everyone was quick to acknowledge Matt Murray was a matter of "right place, right time", and the team quickly moved on. Sullivan was the exact same situation at the exact same time, yet the organization refuses to move on despite all evidence.

This is a team with several generational talents, that spends to the cap every year... yet they will have one playoff series win in seven years, none in the last six, and two straight years out of the playoffs altogether.

Sullivan is not special. Sullivan is doing nothing for this team. They need to move on.

Whether or not Sully will follow the same path as Disco is immaterial to me. 2 years of missing the playoffs, preceded by 4 years without a second round berth, preceded by a 2nd round ouster should be MORE than enough to get canned in the NHL, especially when your roster includes 2 generational talents, and, while not always the best supporting cast, still mostly a decent crop of players.

Bottom line - 1 playoff round win since 2017. That's it. You give him 2018, and MAYBE even 2-3 years after that, but that's it. We're easily 3-4 years past his expiration date. GMKD has had more than enough time to evaluate his performance. I know what he said at his last presser, but it should NOT be acceptable to have that kind of post-season record and still have a job.

Time to go, man. Thanks for what ya did. Hell, I'll even stand and clap for him when he comes back to town with whatever teams he lands with... but it's time for us to move on.

Pretty much says it all for me. Sullivan and his staff have to go.

[FLPensFan]

I didn't put much credence in this thinking that JR probably isn't connected to the Pens organization but with how the team quit in Edmonton it now isn't so farfetched

"The rumor over the weekend through maybe people in the know or people, but I'm around a lot of people that are around the National Hockey League. Some of the players are starting to turn on Mike Sullivan. They are starting to lose faith and lose interest in Mike Sullivan. Maybe that is a big decision that Pittsburgh has to make."

via Jeremy Roenick, Snipes and Stripes

Yeah, I listened to this on his podcast the other day when a writer pointed it out. Honestly, it's very easy to see. This team has been completely inconsistent for 2 years. The PP has stunk and hit rock bottom this year. But even more than that, they have a hard time looking like an NHL hockey team on a consistent basis. They'll play a great game like they did against Vancouver, and two days later it's back to blown coverages, bad pinches, 2-1's galore.

The team has either tuned him out, can't execute, or Sully's tired, cliche "words of wisdom" after a loss have no effect on the team.

I've thought the signs were there all season. Some of the new guys have openly expressed their frustrations at times. Lars Eller hasn't exactly hidden in his locker in post-game interviews. Also, I remember Karlsson being asked earlier this year about what can help the power play - he responded with something like "I have my thoughts on it but I'll keep those to myself". Not exactly a ringing endorsement from within that room.

All season, all last season, I see a team who cannot figure out zone entries with possession so they just dunp and chase to fight board battles - with a roster not built to win a lot of board battles -then endlessly push the puck around the boards with their backs to the net, zero threat to score. Very few opportunities between the circles from this team as opposed to how many shots they give up in that area. Cycle around the boards until someone can throw a wrister from 35 feet and nobody in front of the net to screen a goalie. Is it any wonder why they cannot score goals?

So, why have they not employed anything different? How can a team with Crosby, Malkin, Karlsson struggle every game to make zone entries with a man advantage? How can no member of that coaching staff come up with a way for these players to succeed, to maintain possession, even when on the man advantage? It's maddening to watch the same thing, night after night after night with nothing different.

How can any player in that locker room not tune out what is not working but still mandated???????

While there's always talk of how tight that locker room is, maybe there is some dissention in the room, and not what I would call malicious or bad characters causing it.

Eller reminds me of Orpik in the way he speaks his mind. Karlsson is an elite level veteran. But Sullivan is Sid, Geno and Letang's coach. It's not in any player's best interest to speak out about the coach, but, even in the room, it might be awkward for guys like Eller and Karlsson to suggest anything negative about the coach in the locker room with him being the core's guy.

[lemieuxReturns]

" But Sullivan is Sid, Geno and Letang's coach."

I would say Sully is Sid's coach. I would not say he is Geno and Letang's coach in the sense that they are getting preferential treatment in some way. Geno gets the 3rd and 4th best wings EVERY time. If Sid has a winger go off the ice with an injury, Geno's wing is promoted... to the point where if ANY human was Geno, you would eventually feel slighted.... especially when the fans and media begin to turn on Geno for "not producing". As for Letang, No way he doesnt feel like he was scapegoated for the poor PP when he was removed. Same for Geno in that regard. I would not doubt that Geno and Letang are on the 'other side' of the pro-Sully group.

[ahawk9]

Just saw Nylander had a hat trick last night. Good for him! Might just be a flash of energy after the trade and getting to play with the big club, but I felt he had talent during his short time with the Pens. As with the coach's MO, he slowly had his ice time reduced until he was banished across the state, never to be seen again.

[ahawk9]

I assumed he'd net a hat trick tonight while Bemstrom plays 6 minutes. Maybe he still will.

[maopens]

Just saw Nylander had a hat trick last night. Good for him! Might just be a flash of energy after the trade and getting to play with the big club, but I felt he had talent during his short time with the Pens. As with the coach's MO, he slowly had his ice time reduced until he was banished across the state, never to be seen again.

Nylander has 6 points in 5 games played with Columbus.

Meanwhile, Harkins has 4 points in 42 games played in Pittsburgh this year.
Matthew Phillips, who they picked up (and subsequently dumped) rather than play Nylander, has 5 points in 30 games played in the NHL this season.

At some point, evaluation and utilization has to be addressed.

[largegarlic]

Just saw Nylander had a hat trick last night. Good for him! Might just be a flash of energy after the trade and getting to play with the big club, but I felt he had talent during his short time with the Pens. As with the coach's MO, he slowly had his ice time reduced until he was banished across the state, never to be seen again.

Nylander has 6 points in 5 games played with Columbus.

Meanwhile, Harkins has 4 points in 42 games played in Pittsburgh this year.
Matthew Phillips, who they picked up (and subsequently dumped) rather than play Nylander, has 5 points in 30 games played in the NHL this season.

At some point, evaluation and utilization has to be addressed.

Not to pile on too much, but the guy we initially dumped for Nylander, Lafferty, has 11 g and 10 a this season for Vancouver. I still think that Nylander's a classic AHL/NHL tweener, but yeah, the player usage is really suspect at this point.

[ahawk9]

I agree 100 percent! My biggest beef is that for all the "we need to get younger and hungrier" stuff, they (or is it just Sully) refuse to give young and hungry guys a full shot. Maybe I should amend that to "young and hungry guys with skill" because I'd say Harkins is young and hungry, but he has zero offensive skills. Nylander is a former top 10 pick who has had mixed results but has looked good at times. If he's in your organization after a trade, wouldn't you want to try your best to develop him back into that guy who warranted a first-round pick? Maybe they really did work with him, but who knows? He did fairly well when he was first in Pittsburgh and then dropped off a little. It seems (pure speculation here) that some of these young guys fall off a bit after their intitial burst of energy, and rather than try to get them past that, Sully whittles away their ice time to next to nothing so they know the hammer is about to fall. It makes them tentative and hurts their game which reinforces Sully's MO of not playing these guys much.