VGK

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Re: VGK

Postby Great58 on Fri May 18, 2018 3:41 pm

LimerickPensFan wrote:I've read that the Seattle expansion will have the same rules - with the exception that Vegas is exempt.

I'm not sure that I am fine with Vegas being exempt from the next expansion draft. Other than that, I have been fine with the rules for these expansions. I agree with Jim, it is in the league's best interest to have competitive franchises, and high bid buyers. THe other owners are too, as they get a cut of that pie in exchange for giving up a 4th defenseman, a bottom 6 forward, a backup goalie, or a cap casualty.
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Re: VGK

Postby Daniel on Fri May 18, 2018 3:46 pm

Great58 wrote:
LimerickPensFan wrote:I've read that the Seattle expansion will have the same rules - with the exception that Vegas is exempt.

I'm not sure that I am fine with Vegas being exempt from the next expansion draft. Other than that, I have been fine with the rules for these expansions. I agree with Jim, it is in the league's best interest to have competitive franchises, and high bid buyers. THe other owners are too, as they get a cut of that pie in exchange for giving up a 4th defenseman, a bottom 6 forward, a backup goalie, or a cap casualty.


I agree with the competitive franchise part, but I think Vegas had a competitive advantage when setting up the team. If they went this far with the Nashville rules, then that's fantastic, but to poach 2nd and 3rd line players from each team and hold GMs hostage to get either/or on multiple high end talent shouldn't have been done.
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Re: VGK

Postby IntangibleBeer on Fri May 18, 2018 4:36 pm

I think Vegas' success is due to a number of causes:
  • Pensfan4life8771 wrote:Also on top of all what I said previously...a roster of 23 guys whose previous team said they didn't want them....that would motivate me and piss me off too.
    . This has to be serious motivation; the Knights are a very focused team that outworks everyone else.
  • noname wrote:My theory, McFee made a speed team in the western conference where physicality ruled. They remind me of the 16 Pens team that no one could match up against since no other team went after just speed.
    . I totally agree; these guys are just so much faster.
  • Let's not forget that Head Coach Gallant is pretty motivated as well. He was doing well as Florida's coach before he was jettisoned a few years back. He's done an excellent job getting the most out of his players.

I would love to see them hoist the Cup. :thumb:
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Re: VGK

Postby Pens4Life on Sat May 19, 2018 3:18 am

Really really happy for MAF and also coach Gallant,always liked him.. one more to go and SCF!
But the final with either Caps or Bolts will be much much tougher..
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Re: VGK

Postby stonewizard51 on Sat May 19, 2018 1:00 pm

Pens4Life wrote:Really really happy for MAF and also coach Gallant,always liked him.. one more to go and SCF!
But the final with either Caps or Bolts will be much much tougher..

If Vegas finishes Winnepeg next game they'll have a few more days to rest up. Big if I know.

I would rather see TB take it in 6. The humiliaton alone for Sweaty Teddy would be awesome. Either way let them pound the ever lovin' **** out of each other before the SCF. I do not want the Caps anywhere near the Cup unless they visit the HOF to see it.
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Re: VGK

Postby ville5 on Sat May 19, 2018 1:47 pm

lemieuxReturns wrote:
LimerickPensFan wrote:I've read that the Seattle expansion will have the same rules - with the exception that Vegas is exempt.


Wonder what the fee will be?

$650 million.https://abcnews.go.com/Sports/nhl-owner ... d=53422331

The NHL set the expansion fee at $650 million -- a steep increase from the $500 million the Golden Knights paid to enter the league this season.
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Re: VGK

Postby Daniel on Sat May 19, 2018 2:20 pm

stonewizard51 wrote:
Pens4Life wrote:Really really happy for MAF and also coach Gallant,always liked him.. one more to go and SCF!
But the final with either Caps or Bolts will be much much tougher..

If Vegas finishes Winnepeg next game they'll have a few more days to rest up. Big if I know.

I would rather see TB take it in 6. The humiliaton alone for Sweaty Teddy would be awesome. Either way let them pound the ever lovin' **** out of each other before the SCF. I do not want the Caps anywhere near the Cup unless they visit the HOF to see it.


I think the Caps rationalize any loss in the Conference Finals as "well, we got past the Penguins". It's like the Cleveland Browns view of a successful 1-15 season "well, we beat the Steelers".
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Re: VGK

Postby Antonio on Sat May 19, 2018 5:19 pm

If Vegas beats Winnipeg, I don't see them losing to tb, but then again I've been wrong about Vegas twice in a row already so who knows.
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Re: VGK

Postby flame on Sun May 20, 2018 4:03 am

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Re: VGK

Postby Crashguy66 on Sun May 20, 2018 5:48 pm

Fleury. Just outstanding. Reaves with the game / series winner.
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Re: VGK

Postby pens_CT on Sun May 20, 2018 5:55 pm

Crashguy66 wrote:Fleury. Just outstanding. Reaves with the game / series winner.


Reaves just laughing at all the haters here.
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Re: VGK

Postby thehockeyguru on Sun May 20, 2018 6:02 pm

pens_CT wrote:
Crashguy66 wrote:Fleury. Just outstanding. Reaves with the game / series winner.


Reaves just laughing at all the haters here.

I'm happy for him. He was added to the list of players who never got a fair shake while in Pittsburgh.
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Re: VGK

Postby Crashguy66 on Sun May 20, 2018 6:04 pm

Yeah. I'm not taking a position. Just stating facts. Happy for the ex-Pens.
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Re: VGK

Postby ville5 on Sun May 20, 2018 9:19 pm

And to think VGK had over 20 million in cap space still available. I actually think it was closer to 24 million. Maybe they change some GMs' approach to roster building.
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Re: VGK

Postby no name on Mon May 21, 2018 8:25 am

Vegas will be a power house for years to come. Not only can they sign free agents and their own players. They will have I think 3 or 4 first rounders in this comming draft. I wonder if they will package 2 of those firsts and move down in the draft to get a specific player.

I still can't believe how some GMs protected unproven talent and left really good player available. Well to each their own, lucky how it worked out for us. We still paid a lot for them to take MAF off our hands. MAF truly looks reborn in Vegas.
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Re: VGK

Postby pressure=9Pa on Mon May 21, 2018 9:05 am

flame wrote:https://www.google.com/amp/s/nhl.nbcsports.com/2018/04/18/dont-blame-expansion-draft-rules-for-vegas-success-blame-your-gm/amp/

That’s a pretty good article imo


Very good. But I love the irony that it says Reaves might not play in the series, and a couple of hours later he scores the GWG.
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Re: VGK

Postby FLPensFan on Mon May 21, 2018 9:20 am

NBCSN: The Penguins lose to the Capitals, and there will be no 3-peat this year.

Fleury: Hold my beer, si vous plait.
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Re: VGK

Postby Humperdink on Mon May 21, 2018 10:05 am

pens_CT wrote:
Crashguy66 wrote:Fleury. Just outstanding. Reaves with the game / series winner.


Reaves just laughing at all the haters here.


Game highlights. Check out the linked video and what the announcers have to say about the Reaves GWG and the Vegas 4th line.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1vbyyQZw-xY
Last edited by Humperdink on Mon May 21, 2018 12:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: VGK

Postby LimerickPensFan on Mon May 21, 2018 10:08 am

no name wrote:Vegas will be a power house for years to come. Not only can they sign free agents and their own players. They will have I think 3 or 4 first rounders in this comming draft. I wonder if they will package 2 of those firsts and move down in the draft to get a specific player.

I still can't believe how some GMs protected unproven talent and left really good player available. Well to each their own, lucky how it worked out for us. We still paid a lot for them to take MAF off our hands. MAF truly looks reborn in Vegas.

Vegas still has to deal with the salary cap, and first round picks are not guaranteed success in the NHL - moreso than in any other sport.

MAF wasn't reborn. You're seeing what he could have been had people been willing to play defense in front of him in Pittsburgh. The first two rounds of last year showed what he could have been here. I understand the thought behind keeping Murray over Fleury, but I still believe Fleury was a much better goaltender. I've thought that since Murray first came on the scene.
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Re: VGK

Postby DelPen on Mon May 21, 2018 11:39 am

Fleury had zero pressure to win this year and was never looking over his shoulder. This was the only scenario where he would have played this well. Will be tough to repeat this season again for him now that there are expectations to meet.
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Re: VGK

Postby no name on Mon May 21, 2018 3:05 pm

Daniel wrote:
Great58 wrote:
LimerickPensFan wrote:I've read that the Seattle expansion will have the same rules - with the exception that Vegas is exempt.

I'm not sure that I am fine with Vegas being exempt from the next expansion draft. Other than that, I have been fine with the rules for these expansions. I agree with Jim, it is in the league's best interest to have competitive franchises, and high bid buyers. THe other owners are too, as they get a cut of that pie in exchange for giving up a 4th defenseman, a bottom 6 forward, a backup goalie, or a cap casualty.


I agree with the competitive franchise part, but I think Vegas had a competitive advantage when setting up the team. If they went this far with the Nashville rules, then that's fantastic, but to poach 2nd and 3rd line players from each team and hold GMs hostage to get either/or on multiple high end talent shouldn't have been done.


Well the 30 other owners had to agree to these terms and they could live with it. Hard to believe... But 30 "money starved" owners, ok maybe that's to harsh. 30 money hungry owners agreed to these terms and were ok in stripping their teams to allow this other franchise to get pieces to be competitive in their first year. I don't even think the 30 other owners had any idea this would be the product of this endeavor. All the right pieces fell into place and McFee and his staff made the right moves with what was available.

Now Seattle is going to pay 650m to get this same deal. I bet the other GMs will be a little smarter with getting max value with what they are willing to let go. Unless the league said make players availibel and no "useless trades" to protect players. I would of thought that would of happened a lot more between teams.
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Re: VGK

Postby Daniel on Mon May 21, 2018 3:19 pm

no name wrote:
Daniel wrote:
Great58 wrote:
LimerickPensFan wrote:I've read that the Seattle expansion will have the same rules - with the exception that Vegas is exempt.

I'm not sure that I am fine with Vegas being exempt from the next expansion draft. Other than that, I have been fine with the rules for these expansions. I agree with Jim, it is in the league's best interest to have competitive franchises, and high bid buyers. THe other owners are too, as they get a cut of that pie in exchange for giving up a 4th defenseman, a bottom 6 forward, a backup goalie, or a cap casualty.


I agree with the competitive franchise part, but I think Vegas had a competitive advantage when setting up the team. If they went this far with the Nashville rules, then that's fantastic, but to poach 2nd and 3rd line players from each team and hold GMs hostage to get either/or on multiple high end talent shouldn't have been done.


Well the 30 other owners had to agree to these terms and they could live with it. Hard to believe... But 30 "money starved" owners, ok maybe that's to harsh. 30 money hungry owners agreed to these terms and were ok in stripping their teams to allow this other franchise to get pieces to be competitive in their first year. I don't even think the 30 other owners had any idea this would be the product of this endeavor. All the right pieces fell into place and McFee and his staff made the right moves with what was available.

Now Seattle is going to pay 650m to get this same deal. I bet the other GMs will be a little smarter with getting max value with what they are willing to let go. Unless the league said make players availibel and no "useless trades" to protect players. I would of thought that would of happened a lot more between teams.


Oh, I agree it's the owners fault, doesn't make me less right. :lol: :fist:

Seriously, I don't blame Vegas any more than I blame the Yankees for taking advantage of baseballs inept rules regarding salaries. I'm happy for the Golden Knights, the city, fans, but I still think the owners created an unfair competitive advantage. I liked the article that was posted above, and agree that a lot of GMs made some huge mistakes (Rutherford did as well), but the way it was setup, Vegas was bound to be very good quickly. This good is a sign of everything coming together and quality management.
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Re: VGK

Postby pronovost19 on Tue May 22, 2018 10:17 am

The funny part of the entire situation is that they "set it up" to have the VGK competitive day one. As a business venture it paid off. However, logistically how much more "watered" down is the product?

* It was far too easy. Most teams that build and rebuild have a sense of the cyclical nature of parody run sports. VGK were set up to be a contender from day one.

* The NHL will make so much money off of that franchise it is ridiculous. The problem is...at the expense of what? One could argue that it created a void in the league that allowed for talent to become more diluted and watered down. Thus, now players that would never make it to the NHL are in the rotation. So it had a double impact. Look at the talent NHL teams left unprotected. Why? Cap issues and business decisions. THAT has never been done or allowed in the history of any sport expansion team. So, in the end, they bolstered the expansion team at the expense of a more watered down league that has far too many teams in the first place. Those teams, like the Panthers, had to replace a Marchessault with essentially AHL talent at the bottom end.

* So, those that say the competition has been reduced league wide, YOU ARE RIGHT. I would argue that based on numbers alone it has to be in the 5-7% range of dilution. I might like Kool-Aid, but when you water it down the product just doesn't have the same taste.
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Re: VGK

Postby Southern Fan on Tue May 22, 2018 10:20 am

GM's will do a better job preparing in advance of the entry draft. Assume big drop in no trade/movement clauses and huge contracts that will be too risky for Seattle to take. The cap increase has helped GM's get a little smarter with contract structures.

Vegas = Premier League Leicester City

Just a question, If Vegas wins the cup will the parade be at 3:00 AM ?
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Re: VGK

Postby pronovost19 on Tue May 22, 2018 11:49 am

Yes, and whatever happens there will stay there.
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