Penguins summer and 21-22 roster decisions

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Penguins summer and 21-22 roster decisions

Postby FLPensFan on Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:03 am

The trade deadline has passed, so naturally, in keeping with the spirit of continuing to talk about players and roster building, I figured, sure, why not start looking ahead to next season's looming roster decisions.

If you are interested in expansion draft discussion, I had started this thread maybe a month ago: Penguins Expansion Draft Protection List Discussion

In terms of next season, the Penguins are going to have several tough decisions to make. As of this moment, the Penguins have the following players with contracts for next season (only those who have played NHL games this year are listed):

Forwards(11): Crosby, Malkin, Guentzel, Rust, Kapanen, Tanev, Zucker, McCann, Carter, Lafferty, Angello (TOTAL=$46.951M)
Defense(8): Letang, Dumoulin, Pettersson, Matheson, Marino, Ruhwedel, Friedman, Riikola (TOTAL=$27.275M)
Goalie(2): Jarry, DeSmith (TOTAL=4.750M)

21 players, 78.976M in committed cap space, roughly 2.53M in cap space remaining.

The team has the following UFAs: Sceviour, Gaudreau, Rodrigues, Ceci
The team has the following RFAs: ZAR, Zohorna, Blueger, Jankowski

Who are you keeping? Who are you letting walk? Who are you looking to trade to acquire draft picks or other players? Anyone on the UFA market that could be a good addition at a fair price?
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Re: Penguins summer and 21-22 roster decisions

Postby DelPen on Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:12 am

I look to trade Zucker, Pettersson and Letang if all three are left after expansion. I think Zucker might be the right kind of player for Seattle to take since he is a legit top 6 wing in the right team and he is very active in the community he is in and would be good for Seattle. The other two are garbage and I’d rather see Joseph get more ice time over Pettersson now and I’d like to keep Ceci. Give Friedman a chance too if another RD can’t be had.

Letang is killing us. He needs gone.

Bring back Blueger, ZAR and Zohorna and then also give Poulin and Legare a chance in camp. That’s really all that needs done right now until the cap goes up. A couple another small moves can be made too.
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Re: Penguins summer and 21-22 roster decisions

Postby pens_CT on Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:23 am

FLPensFan wrote:The trade deadline has passed, so naturally, in keeping with the spirit of continuing to talk about players and roster building, I figured, sure, why not start looking ahead to next season's looming roster decisions.

If you are interested in expansion draft discussion, I had started this thread maybe a month ago: Penguins Expansion Draft Protection List Discussion

In terms of next season, the Penguins are going to have several tough decisions to make. As of this moment, the Penguins have the following players with contracts for next season (only those who have played NHL games this year are listed):

Forwards(11): Crosby, Malkin, Guentzel, Rust, Kapanen, Tanev, Zucker, McCann, Carter, Lafferty, Angello (TOTAL=$46.951M)
Defense(8): Letang, Dumoulin, Pettersson, Matheson, Marino, Ruhwedel, Friedman, Riikola (TOTAL=$27.275M)
Goalie(2): Jarry, DeSmith (TOTAL=4.750M)

21 players, 78.976M in committed cap space, roughly 2.53M in cap space remaining.

The team has the following UFAs: Sceviour, Gaudreau, Rodrigues, Ceci
The team has the following RFAs: ZAR, Zohorna, Blueger, Jankowski

Who are you keeping? Who are you letting walk? Who are you looking to trade to acquire draft picks or other players? Anyone on the UFA market that could be a good addition at a fair price?


In the let walk bucket: Sceviour, Jankowski

Re-sign bucket: ZAR, Zohorna, Blueger, Ceci**, Rodriques, Gaudreau

Trade Candidates: Zucker, Pettersson

Possible Trade Candidates (if you don't believe you can re-sign them): Letang, Rust

** Re-signing Ceci is contingent on moving out some money (Pettersson)
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Re: Penguins summer and 21-22 roster decisions

Postby Pensfan4life8771 on Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:38 am

https://www.capfriendly.com/armchair-gm/team/2353095

This is my best guess.

I think we will send MP off for a higher pick. Will replace him with a combination of POJ/Ceci (I think Ceci def. is resigned).

Other than that I think Blueger and ZAR are top priorities for resigning. Also I did a bridge type deal for 2 yrs for ZAR/Rodrigues/Blueger until cap goes up.

The only piece I am not sure of is who Seattle takes.
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Re: Penguins summer and 21-22 roster decisions

Postby Pensfan4life8771 on Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:44 am

I also think this offseason you will see Geno resigned at 5yrs @ around 7.5M (2M decrease) which will be used to extend Rust for 5 yrs at around $5.5M.

Not sure exactly how much Geno contract will dip but I think it will a little from the $9.5M.
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Re: Penguins summer and 21-22 roster decisions

Postby FLPensFan on Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:49 am

Pensfan4life8771 wrote:I also think this offseason you will see Geno resigned at 5yrs @ around 7.5M (2M decrease) which will be used to extend Rust for 5 yrs at around $5.5M.

Not sure exactly how much Geno contract will dip but I think it will a little from the $9.5M.

I think 5 years is way too long. If they extend Geno and/or Letang, they will likely match them up to Sid's term, which would mean a 3 year extension for Malkin. I do think 7.5M is fair $$$ for him. If we resign Letang, I think he should come in at about 5.5M-6M AAV.
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Re: Penguins summer and 21-22 roster decisions

Postby Pensfan4life8771 on Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:54 am

FLPensFan wrote:
Pensfan4life8771 wrote:I also think this offseason you will see Geno resigned at 5yrs @ around 7.5M (2M decrease) which will be used to extend Rust for 5 yrs at around $5.5M.

Not sure exactly how much Geno contract will dip but I think it will a little from the $9.5M.

I think 5 years is way too long. If they extend Geno and/or Letang, they will likely match them up to Sid's term, which would mean a 3 year extension for Malkin. I do think 7.5M is fair $$$ for him. If we resign Letang, I think he should come in at about 5.5M-6M AAV.



I was thinking of aligning it with Crosby, but I was also assuming and I should've mentioned this piece. I think Crosby will be extended 2 more years out. That is why I added the five vs three.
Last edited by Pensfan4life8771 on Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:56 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Penguins summer and 21-22 roster decisions

Postby Pensfan4life8771 on Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:55 am

https://www.capfriendly.com/armchair-gm/team/2353119

I tried to do two years out but there is just way too much unknown with offseason progression of AHL players + Exp draft/FA turnover but I took a shot.
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Re: Penguins summer and 21-22 roster decisions

Postby Cow_Master66 on Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:00 am

I'm not a Letang fan but there's no reason to expect him to take a pay cut.
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Re: Penguins summer and 21-22 roster decisions

Postby Pensfan4life8771 on Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:03 am

Cow_Master66 wrote:I'm not a Letang fan but there's no reason to expect him to take a pay cut.


I think of the big three that need resigned in 2022 off-season I expect Letang least likely to be resigned.
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Re: Penguins summer and 21-22 roster decisions

Postby FLPensFan on Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:05 am

FLPensFan wrote:The trade deadline has passed, so naturally, in keeping with the spirit of continuing to talk about players and roster building, I figured, sure, why not start looking ahead to next season's looming roster decisions.

If you are interested in expansion draft discussion, I had started this thread maybe a month ago: Penguins Expansion Draft Protection List Discussion

In terms of next season, the Penguins are going to have several tough decisions to make. As of this moment, the Penguins have the following players with contracts for next season (only those who have played NHL games this year are listed):

Forwards(11): Crosby, Malkin, Guentzel, Rust, Kapanen, Tanev, Zucker, McCann, Carter, Lafferty, Angello (TOTAL=$46.951M)
Defense(8): Letang, Dumoulin, Pettersson, Matheson, Marino, Ruhwedel, Friedman, Riikola (TOTAL=$27.275M)
Goalie(2): Jarry, DeSmith (TOTAL=4.750M)

21 players, 78.976M in committed cap space, roughly 2.53M in cap space remaining.

The team has the following UFAs: Sceviour, Gaudreau, Rodrigues, Ceci
The team has the following RFAs: ZAR, Zohorna, Blueger, Jankowski

Who are you keeping? Who are you letting walk? Who are you looking to trade to acquire draft picks or other players? Anyone on the UFA market that could be a good addition at a fair price?

So what would I do? Some things are hard to fully determine because of the expansion draft, but also, because we know Hextall and Burke likely want to change the dynamic of this team a little bit. Guys that were almost untouchable level under Rutherford may not have that same security under the new regime.

On the UFAs, I think Sceviour is a sure goner. Angello or Zohorna add size, which new regime wants, and are also cheaper, which is a big plus.
The other 3 are all tough. I think the team would like to sign Gaudreau to another 700-750K deal if they can.
I think they'd like to bring back Rodrigues at a decent price, but that isn't a guarantee depending on other moves they may make (or who is taken in expansion draft).
They'd be crazy not to at least consider bringing Ceci back, but, that's a hard decision to make unless they cleanup the defense first. Really can't go much higher than 2-2.5M if he's going to be a bottom pairing guy.

On the RFAs, I'd sign the first 3, although, ZAR could be interesting with his goal scoring run he had and already at 1M AAV. There has also been some evidence that, without Tanev on his line, ZAR isn't nearly as effective. He's also a decent candidate for Seattle to claim.

Jankowski is the tough one. In my book, it's a surefire don't QO him and let him walk. But Sullivan continually praises the guy. It would not surprise me for them to try and retain him, although, I just don't see the fit. He has the size that Hextall/Burke like, but he doesn't play big at all. Again, if someone like Blueger were claimed, he has a better chance of being retained, but, if Blueger is here and the team resigns Gaudreau, he should be shown the door.

On the trade front, I think you'll see either Rust or Zucker moved, and a bigger bodied forward brought in up front, whether as part of the trade return or as a UFA. Preference would be to keep Rust, but, if he's looking for much above 5.5M on a new deal, that likely won't work. I liked the Zucker trade at the time, even if maybe we gave up a bit too much. I thought he would be a Rust type player with a bit higher offensive upside...until Rust said hold my beer and has gone off the last 2 years, while Zucker is often injured and looks lost. At this point, I'd be willing to move him out just to clear the salary and do something different.

On the backend, cannot fathom this team bringing Riikola back next year. He is signed, and did go unclaimed when waived, but, I'm hoping that over the summer when cap space is a bit more fluid, someone will give up a late round pick for him. Like the player, hate the usage.

I also believe that Pettersson will be traded, but, I have heard that Burke "likes his size." I mean, sure he's tall, but he not 220. He's like 180 soaking wet. It's nothing against the player (although he hasn't been good for long stretches). His underlying numbers have improved a bit during the Penguins good March. But, it's simply the fact that Pettersson is not able to bump Dumo off the top pairing, Matheson provides much better offensive capabilities, and POJ is 4 times cheaper.
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Re: Penguins summer and 21-22 roster decisions

Postby FLPensFan on Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:15 am

Pensfan4life8771 wrote:
Cow_Master66 wrote:I'm not a Letang fan but there's no reason to expect him to take a pay cut.


I think of the big three that need resigned in 2022 off-season I expect Letang least likely to be resigned.

If Geno and Letang aren't open to a paycut, I don't want them back. In a reduced cap world, we cannot be giving 35 plus players the contracts they earned 7 plus years ago. There's a huge, enormous risk that by the time that deal is done, you'll be largely overpaying both of them.
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Re: Penguins summer and 21-22 roster decisions

Postby Pensfan4life8771 on Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:20 am

FLPens - What is your thought on a Zucker for Domi trade in offseason?

Domi would qualify as a bigger body versus Zucker.
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Re: Penguins summer and 21-22 roster decisions

Postby Cow_Master66 on Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:24 am

Pensfan4life8771 wrote:
Cow_Master66 wrote:I'm not a Letang fan but there's no reason to expect him to take a pay cut.


I think of the big three that need resigned in 2022 off-season I expect Letang least likely to be resigned.


Of the 3, probably right, but that doesn't mean he will be taking a pay cut. So the question becomes what do you do with him?

Maybe he does agree to take a cut on a short term deal with idea that he can retire in 2-3 years. He's given no indication he plans to hang them up, and he's not slowing down statistically (or in bone-headedness).
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Re: Penguins summer and 21-22 roster decisions

Postby Ohio_Pens_fan on Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:24 am

FLPensFan wrote:
Pensfan4life8771 wrote:
Cow_Master66 wrote:I'm not a Letang fan but there's no reason to expect him to take a pay cut.


I think of the big three that need resigned in 2022 off-season I expect Letang least likely to be resigned.

If Geno and Letang aren't open to a paycut, I don't want them back. In a reduced cap world, we cannot be giving 35 plus players the contracts they earned 7 plus years ago. There's a huge, enormous risk that by the time that deal is done, you'll be largely overpaying both of them.

Don't you think that 7.5 and 5.5 respectively for Geno and Letang is still a bit too much?
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Re: Penguins summer and 21-22 roster decisions

Postby Pensfan4life8771 on Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:26 am

Cow_Master66 wrote:
Pensfan4life8771 wrote:
Cow_Master66 wrote:I'm not a Letang fan but there's no reason to expect him to take a pay cut.


I think of the big three that need resigned in 2022 off-season I expect Letang least likely to be resigned.


Of the 3, probably right, but that doesn't mean he will be taking a pay cut. So the question becomes what do you do with him?

Maybe he does agree to take a cut on a short term deal with idea that he can retire in 2-3 years. He's given no indication he plans to hang them up, and he's not slowing down statistically (or in bone-headedness).



That is the million dollar question IMHO. If you can resign him for say $5M at three years I say you do it. Let him groom the young guys (POJ / John M / whoever else comes along). Kind of like a Chara situation in Boston minus the part of going to DC LOL
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Re: Penguins summer and 21-22 roster decisions

Postby Pensfan4life8771 on Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:28 am

I keep thinking of who will be resigned first long term of the three (Rust/Letang/Geno).

I think you almost have to extend Geno first (probably this summer). Geno will be the most expensive of the three and I would think once you establish his contract extension it will roll into Rust and Letang. Of course as I type this though Rust is also the youngest of the three...grrr.

The other tricky part in all of this is how are the dollars setup? Say you know Cap is going up in 2023, would you do this:

Year 1: $3M
Year 2 - 4: $6M
Year 5: $5M

Or something like that.
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Re: Penguins summer and 21-22 roster decisions

Postby KG on Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:34 am

I would definitely try to lock up Rust. He deserves another contract. Smart player, fits right in. He should age well.

Letang and Geno should be extended as well. Preferably at a reduced cap hit.

Zucker and MP are tying up almost $10mill in cap space. Those two have to go. Preferably MP gets picked in the expansion draft.

They also need to make space for Poulin if he’s ready.

POJ and Friedman could/should see regular time next season.

Ceci I would bring back but I have no idea what the budget or ask would be.
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Re: Penguins summer and 21-22 roster decisions

Postby murphydump55 on Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:34 am

Pensfan4life8771 wrote:FLPens - What is your thought on a Zucker for Domi trade in offseason?

Domi would qualify as a bigger body versus Zucker.


Back to back healthy scratches and a lot of word that he has problems with seemingly every coach.
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Re: Penguins summer and 21-22 roster decisions

Postby Pensfan4life8771 on Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:35 am

murphydump55 wrote:
Pensfan4life8771 wrote:FLPens - What is your thought on a Zucker for Domi trade in offseason?

Domi would qualify as a bigger body versus Zucker.


Back to back healthy scratches and a lot of word that he has problems with seemingly every coach.


Ah that makes sense. Thanks for the info on that one.
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Re: Penguins summer and 21-22 roster decisions

Postby Pensfan4life8771 on Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:41 am

Just strictly from a joking manner but could you imagine this offseason? LOL

https://www.capfriendly.com/armchair-gm/team/2353223
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Re: Penguins summer and 21-22 roster decisions

Postby FLPensFan on Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:41 am

Pensfan4life8771 wrote:
murphydump55 wrote:
Pensfan4life8771 wrote:FLPens - What is your thought on a Zucker for Domi trade in offseason?

Domi would qualify as a bigger body versus Zucker.


Back to back healthy scratches and a lot of word that he has problems with seemingly every coach.


Ah that makes sense. Thanks for the info on that one.

I'll add that, I don't like Domi at 5.3M AAV, either. Good value when he was 3.1M. Bad value now at 5.3M, aside from being a guy possibly going to his 4th team already.
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Re: Penguins summer and 21-22 roster decisions

Postby FLPensFan on Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:44 am

Ohio_Pens_fan wrote:
FLPensFan wrote:
Pensfan4life8771 wrote:
Cow_Master66 wrote:I'm not a Letang fan but there's no reason to expect him to take a pay cut.


I think of the big three that need resigned in 2022 off-season I expect Letang least likely to be resigned.

If Geno and Letang aren't open to a paycut, I don't want them back. In a reduced cap world, we cannot be giving 35 plus players the contracts they earned 7 plus years ago. There's a huge, enormous risk that by the time that deal is done, you'll be largely overpaying both of them.

Don't you think that 7.5 and 5.5 respectively for Geno and Letang is still a bit too much?

No. Unless they really fell off a cliff next season, they are still producing at a high level. Durability becomes a bit of an issue with both of them, but, there's a fine line between pay cut due to reduced production/durability/cap issues and a huge cut insulting the player.
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Re: Penguins summer and 21-22 roster decisions

Postby FLPensFan on Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:48 am

KG wrote:I would definitely try to lock up Rust. He deserves another contract. Smart player, fits right in. He should age well.

Letang and Geno should be extended as well. Preferably at a reduced cap hit.

Zucker and MP are tying up almost $10mill in cap space. Those two have to go. Preferably MP gets picked in the expansion draft.

They also need to make space for Poulin if he’s ready.

POJ and Friedman could/should see regular time next season.

Ceci I would bring back but I have no idea what the budget or ask would be.

I forgot to mention Poulin and was planning on it. I envision him being a WBS guy next season. Maybe Hextall/Burke will see something different, or give him a shot due to having some size...but I was fairly disappointed in Poulin this camp, and I don't know if it is his fault or management's fault. I expected him to get more of a look. The fact that he didn't make it and we are playing guys like Jankowski, Sceviour, Lafferty, Angello, Zohorna, Rodrigues over a skilled guy like Poulin isn't very encouraging.

POJ should challenge for a 3rd pairing spot next season, and I'd like to see what Friedman can do. Ruhwedel could find himself as a WBS callup next season unless someone claims him.
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Re: Penguins summer and 21-22 roster decisions

Postby Jim on Tue Apr 20, 2021 2:30 pm

Pensfan4life8771 wrote:FLPens - What is your thought on a Zucker for Domi trade in offseason?

Domi would qualify as a bigger body versus Zucker.


MDomi: 5'10, 192
Zucker: 5'11, 192
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