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2018 Summer Game Plan

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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby Puck-Lurker on Mon Jul 09, 2018 12:59 pm

Not sure what the love affair with Simon is about. But if it means we nudge Sprong to #13-14, I think staff is nuts.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby thehockeyguru on Mon Jul 09, 2018 1:08 pm

Puck-Lurker wrote:Not sure what the love affair with Simon is about. But if it means we nudge Sprong to #13-14, I think staff is nuts.


If Sid wants Simon on this LW over Guentzel ok. But if he wants him on the RW and Guentzel on LW that creates a real RW log jam.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby Antonio on Mon Jul 09, 2018 2:55 pm

Simon is this year's Rowney. Inexplicably loved by the coach.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby no name on Mon Jul 09, 2018 3:07 pm

longtimefan wrote:https://pittsburghhockeynow.com/sources-penguins-max-pacioretty-trade-unlikely/

Kingerski saying Pacioretty deal unlikely, which is what I assumed.

Despite recent national reports, multiple sources at different levels of the Pittsburgh Penguins organization have confirmed to Pittsburgh Hockey Now the Penguins are not in serious talks to acquire Montreal Canadiens left wing and captain Max Pacioretty.

The sources conceded the Penguins did make contact with Canadiens GM Marc Bergevin about Pacioretty. The Canadiens ask for Pacioretty was too rich for Penguins General Manager Jim Rutherford and the talks did not gain traction or advance past preliminary stages.


https://www.spectorshockey.net/2018/07/ ... ly-8-2018/

Spector's has a bunch on the Karlsson saga and a few other little tidbits. Justin Faulk's name has come up a lot, and this might give some insight on the value the Canes are placing on him.

Despite the addition of defenseman Brandon Manning, Powers believes the Blackhawks still must upgrade their blueline for 2018-19. “The Carolina Hurricanes are still expected to move Justin Faulk, who would be an upgrade for the Blackhawks as a right-handed defenseman. The cost may be too much though, as multiple reports have said the Hurricanes want Brandon Saad in exchange for Faulk.”


I really think GM Jimmy drops his line in just about everyone just to see what they want. Also it plants a seed with that GM to contact the pens if you got a deal brewing with another team. Seems like you would have to give up Sprong plus a first rounder and a roster player (good enough but also cap relief to fit Pak in.)
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby Hatrick on Mon Jul 09, 2018 4:57 pm

LimerickPensFan wrote:I hate picking lines before the season even starts. Basically, line combinations rarely last longer than the printout prior to the game. Saying that, I'm wondering if they're thinking of moving Hornqvist and Guentzel to third line and having Sid with (two kids) Simon and Sprong. Have Haggy and Kessel flanking Brassard, and have fun with the fourth line.

do you mean guentzel and horni on second next to malkin or did you mean hagelin and phil with malkin, unless you are calling brassards line the second and malkins the third you have a typo somewhere but im not certain which combo is the typo.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby Henry Hank on Mon Jul 09, 2018 5:02 pm

It's just odd that this team may have Simon jump over Sprong and ZAR on the youth depth chart, for no apparent reason.


There's not no apparent reason. The reason being reported is that Sid likes playing with him, which understandably carries some weight.

Based on what we've seen of the three, I don't think it'd be a surprise if any of them makes it or if none of them do. Despite differences in pedigree, they've all shown similar but inconsistent flashes of effectiveness. I hope they all get a chance. I do think it's in their best interest that Sprong gets a legit opportunity since he's got the highest upside in theory.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby Henry Hank on Mon Jul 09, 2018 5:03 pm

And it's always possible that Guentzel doesn't play with Sid. He had a great 2017 playoffs with him but then that didn't carry over into the following season. Then he was awesome in the playoffs again. I don't think Jake and Sid have to be married because it's a combo that only at times has been strong.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby LimerickPensFan on Mon Jul 09, 2018 5:04 pm

Hatrick wrote:
LimerickPensFan wrote:I hate picking lines before the season even starts. Basically, line combinations rarely last longer than the printout prior to the game. Saying that, I'm wondering if they're thinking of moving Hornqvist and Guentzel to third line and having Sid with (two kids) Simon and Sprong. Have Haggy and Kessel flanking Brassard, and have fun with the fourth line.

do you mean guentzel and horni on second next to malkin or did you mean hagelin and phil with malkin, unless you are calling brassards line the second and malkins the third you have a typo somewhere but im not certain which combo is the typo.

I'm meaning I screwed up and meant to have Horny and Guentzel on the second line with Malkin.

The keys between "second" and "third" are so close together, I must have hit the wrong ones. :face:
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby DelPen on Mon Jul 09, 2018 8:42 pm

So maybe this:

Simon-Crosby-Sprong
Hagelin-Malkin-Hornqvist
Guentzel-Brassard-Kessel
Cullen/ZAR-Sheahan-Rust

If that top line can click again that’s a deep lineup.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby longtimefan on Mon Jul 09, 2018 8:45 pm

If Simon proves to be able to produce more than we perceive, it can be nothing but good news. I think it was our perception that put him behind Sprong and ZAR. He actually has played more NHL games than either of the other two. His was a rookie, and his regular season performance stacks up well against both Sheary and Rust in their rookie seasons in 2015. I found this on pensburgh.com.

https://www.pensburgh.com/2018/7/6/1753 ... s-penguins

[quote]If recent years are any indication, Crosby will likely cycle through a bunch of different wingers as the season goes on. Probably at the end of the day it will be Jake Guentzel there, and you would think when it’s playoff hockey it means it’s Patric Hornqvist time.

But it’s tough to ignore (even in a somewhat small sample) that Simon and Crosby controlled play to the tune of 60.6% of Corsi and the Pens posted 3.29 Goals/60 with the pair out there.

Simon isn’t a flashy player, but he definitely seems to think the game well which always is a plus for success playing with Crosby. /quote]

If Simon performs higher than our perceptions, it makes the team much stronger. We also know he can play both sides.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby thehockeyguru on Mon Jul 09, 2018 8:46 pm

DelPen wrote:So maybe this:

Simon-Crosby-Sprong
Hagelin-Malkin-Hornqvist
Guentzel-Brassard-Kessel
Cullen/ZAR-Sheahan-Rust

If that top line can click again that’s a deep lineup.


I wouldn't be surprised if you're right. Though I could see Hornqvist and Kessel swapped.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby FLPensFan on Mon Jul 09, 2018 9:30 pm

thehockeyguru wrote:
DelPen wrote:So maybe this:

Simon-Crosby-Sprong
Hagelin-Malkin-Hornqvist
Guentzel-Brassard-Kessel
Cullen/ZAR-Sheahan-Rust

If that top line can click again that’s a deep lineup.


I wouldn't be surprised if you're right. Though I could see Hornqvist and Kessel swapped.

I don't think Simon's game is defensively sound enough to have both Simon and Sprong on the 1st line.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby LimerickPensFan on Mon Jul 09, 2018 10:57 pm

thehockeyguru wrote:
DelPen wrote:So maybe this:

Simon-Crosby-Sprong
Hagelin-Malkin-Hornqvist
Guentzel-Brassard-Kessel
Cullen/ZAR-Sheahan-Rust

If that top line can click again that’s a deep lineup.


I wouldn't be surprised if you're right. Though I could see Hornqvist and Kessel swapped.

Funny, I was thinking of swapping Hagelin and Guentzel.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby Maestro on Mon Jul 09, 2018 11:03 pm

I agree with these lines if the goal is depth.

DelPen wrote:So maybe this:

Simon-Crosby-Sprong
Hagelin-Malkin-Hornqvist
Guentzel-Brassard-Kessel
Cullen/ZAR-Sheahan-Rust

If that top line can click again that’s a deep lineup.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby Maestro on Mon Jul 09, 2018 11:06 pm

The bit I got to see Jake play with Phil I thought there was some chemistry. They seem a bit similar as passing scorers. Dangerous together.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby Maestro on Mon Jul 09, 2018 11:08 pm

FLPensFan wrote:
thehockeyguru wrote:
DelPen wrote:So maybe this:

Simon-Crosby-Sprong
Hagelin-Malkin-Hornqvist
Guentzel-Brassard-Kessel
Cullen/ZAR-Sheahan-Rust

If that top line can click again that’s a deep lineup.


I wouldn't be surprised if you're right. Though I could see Hornqvist and Kessel swapped.

I don't think Simon's game is defensively sound enough to have both Simon and Sprong on the 1st line.


I thought the whole Sprong 'saga' last season was for him to be strong away from puck.

#Sprong4Selke2019
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby Jmalone on Tue Jul 10, 2018 12:56 am

All three of Sprong, Kessel and Hornqvist should play on all 3 lines at some point this season. Injuries happen and lines don't stay together forever. LW could be shuffled around with the players we have. I like Guentzel and Phil together. I'd start the season with this:

Simon-Crosby-Sprong

Crosby will make both better and open space for Sprong. Sid likes Simon.

Hagelin-Malkin-Hornqvist

Malkin between the Sweeds works.

Guentzel-Brassard-Kessel.

You won't find a better 3rd line. This is better than some 1st and 2nd lines.

Aston-Reese-Sheahan-Rust.

Another excellent line as a 4th.

Have Cullen play C or LW in case of injury.

I dont think I'm missing anyone.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby FLPensFan on Tue Jul 10, 2018 9:13 am

Maestro wrote:
FLPensFan wrote:
thehockeyguru wrote:
DelPen wrote:So maybe this:

Simon-Crosby-Sprong
Hagelin-Malkin-Hornqvist
Guentzel-Brassard-Kessel
Cullen/ZAR-Sheahan-Rust

If that top line can click again that’s a deep lineup.


I wouldn't be surprised if you're right. Though I could see Hornqvist and Kessel swapped.

I don't think Simon's game is defensively sound enough to have both Simon and Sprong on the 1st line.


I thought the whole Sprong 'saga' last season was for him to be strong away from puck.

#Sprong4Selke2019

I don't think Sprong is going to go from terrible to Selke-level in 1 or 2 seasons. I don't think his defense is as bad as the team made it seem (although, I didn't watch a lot of WBS games), I do think he has improved, but, I would say he is probably average at best right now defensively.

Rutherford has been preaching balance throughout the lineup. I do think that means scoring, but I also do believe it means defensively as well.

Guentzel will work well with anyone, IMO. Remember, when he first started with the Penguins, he was playing with Geno when he scored his first several goals. I think Guentzel will work on any one of the top 3 lines.....but, his chemistry last season was so good with Crosby that I would hesitate to break that up immediately if there isn't a need. If they go to camp and its not there, or start the season together and it isn't there, fine change it up.

Crosby and Guentzel worked well together last season. Malkin and the Swedes worked well, as did Malkin, Hagelin, and Rust. My biggest concern is finding something that works well for the 3rd and 4th lines, as I think Sid and Geno typically make it work with what they have.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby FLPensFan on Tue Jul 10, 2018 9:54 am

Waiting to see the $ amount, but Kucherov's agent Dan Milstein (also Panarin's agent) just tweeted out that Kucherov just signed an 8 year extension with the Lightning.

UPDATE: Per CapFriendly, 9.5M AAV over 8 years.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby lemieuxReturns on Tue Jul 10, 2018 10:02 am

FLPensFan wrote:Waiting to see the $ amount, but Kucherov's agent Dan Milstein (also Panarin's agent) just tweeted out that Kucherov just signed an 8 year extension with the Lightning.

UPDATE: Per CapFriendly, 9.5M AAV over 8 years.


Wow. How are they going to make all of this work?
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby FLPensFan on Tue Jul 10, 2018 10:15 am

lemieuxReturns wrote:
FLPensFan wrote:Waiting to see the $ amount, but Kucherov's agent Dan Milstein (also Panarin's agent) just tweeted out that Kucherov just signed an 8 year extension with the Lightning.

UPDATE: Per CapFriendly, 9.5M AAV over 8 years.


Wow. How are they going to make all of this work?

Well, I would say this officially puts them out of the running for Erik Karlsson. They won't have the space to pay him after this year. Bolts have 65M in salary next year (19-20 season) for only 11 players.
--They'll need to pay Brayden Point next year (66 points this past season). He is an RFA after this season.
--Yanni Gourde is a UFA after this season, and Gourde put up 64 points this past season. He will need a new deal next year.
--Tampa only has 3 defensemen (Hedman, McDonagh, Sergachev) signed beyond this year.

So how do they make it work beyond this season.....
1) Find a taker for Ryan Callahan's 5.8M cap hit. Contract runs out after next season, but they can't afford him over Point and Gourde.
2) I'd assume they will let Coburn and Girardi walk after the season. They'll need to resign Stralman, Koekkoek, and Dotchin, and likely bring in a solid vet in case Koekkoek or Dotchin struggle.
3) I think they may have to consider moving Alex Killorn at some point as well. They have the core signed. They will need to decide to keep Killorn (who is going to be 29 heading into the season), or being able to resign Point (only 22) or keep Gourde. I think Killorn brings a balance of size, skill, scoring, and defense though that they don't have.
4) They could consider trading Yanni Gourde. He'll be 27 mid season, with 64 points last year in 82 games, he had only 22 NHL games under his belt prior. Maybe they deal Gourde to someone with the caveat that they have to take Callahan's salary too.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby Steve on Tue Jul 10, 2018 10:44 am

FLPensFan wrote:Waiting to see the $ amount, but Kucherov's agent Dan Milstein (also Panarin's agent) just tweeted out that Kucherov just signed an 8 year extension with the Lightning.

UPDATE: Per CapFriendly, 9.5M AAV over 8 years.


I heard a rumor yesterday about a three way trade sending Kucherov to the NYR, Karlsson to Tampa and a bunch of picks/prospects from the Rangers to Ottawa - and then the Rangers or Sens backed out at the last minute leaving Tampa quite annoyed.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby no name on Tue Jul 10, 2018 11:04 am

Would love to see:

Sprong Sid Simon
Horny Geno Hagelin
Guentzel Sheehan Kessel
ZAR Cullen Rust

Trade Brassard and Johnson for a defenseman upgrade at the deadline.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby FLPensFan on Tue Jul 10, 2018 11:15 am

no name wrote:Would love to see:

Sprong Sid Simon
Horny Geno Hagelin
Guentzel Sheehan Kessel
ZAR Cullen Rust

Trade Brassard and Johnson for a defenseman upgrade at the deadline.

There's one player who could add some intrigue to trading Brassard during training camp.......Jordy Bellerive. It's a stretch, but recall that Bellerive was very good last year in training camp. I have not heard of any talk from Rutherford that Bellerive would play somewhere other than center, though, that could be because he's not under full team control (WBS vs Juniors).

If Bellerive came into camp and was lighting it up like he did last year, I'd be a little more open to moving Brassard, and letting Bellerive be the 3C, and still having Sheahan, Cullen, and Blueger in the mix for depth. You will still lose the the Brassard to top 6 if Sid/Geno get hurt......but most teams aren't going to have that anyways. I still think it is a big, big, stretch though that Sullivan/Rutherford would go with a 19 year old 3C when chasing a Cup.
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Re: 2018 Summer Game Plan

Postby longtimefan on Tue Jul 10, 2018 11:22 am

FLPensFan wrote:
lemieuxReturns wrote:
FLPensFan wrote:Waiting to see the $ amount, but Kucherov's agent Dan Milstein (also Panarin's agent) just tweeted out that Kucherov just signed an 8 year extension with the Lightning.

UPDATE: Per CapFriendly, 9.5M AAV over 8 years.


Wow. How are they going to make all of this work?

Well, I would say this officially puts them out of the running for Erik Karlsson. They won't have the space to pay him after this year. Bolts have 65M in salary next year (19-20 season) for only 11 players.
--They'll need to pay Brayden Point next year (66 points this past season). He is an RFA after this season.
--Yanni Gourde is a UFA after this season, and Gourde put up 64 points this past season. He will need a new deal next year.
--Tampa only has 3 defensemen (Hedman, McDonagh, Sergachev) signed beyond this year.

So how do they make it work beyond this season.....
1) Find a taker for Ryan Callahan's 5.8M cap hit. Contract runs out after next season, but they can't afford him over Point and Gourde.
2) I'd assume they will let Coburn and Girardi walk after the season. They'll need to resign Stralman, Koekkoek, and Dotchin, and likely bring in a solid vet in case Koekkoek or Dotchin struggle.
3) I think they may have to consider moving Alex Killorn at some point as well. They have the core signed. They will need to decide to keep Killorn (who is going to be 29 heading into the season), or being able to resign Point (only 22) or keep Gourde. I think Killorn brings a balance of size, skill, scoring, and defense though that they don't have.
4) They could consider trading Yanni Gourde. He'll be 27 mid season, with 64 points last year in 82 games, he had only 22 NHL games under his belt prior. Maybe they deal Gourde to someone with the caveat that they have to take Callahan's salary too.


https://www.spectorshockey.net/2018/07/ ... ucherov-2/

A different view from Spector's on Karlsson.

Chris Johnston

@reporterchris
Extending Nikita Kucherov does not take #TBLightning out of the Erik Karlsson trade talks. Quite the opposite; it gives them more certainty about their future.

Word is they continue to engage outside teams on a potential three-way deal with OTT.


It’s not surprising Kucherov got this big raise. After all, he left money on the table in his previous contract to give the Lightning more cap flexibility with the promise of a bigger reward later on. He could’ve sought much more but once again appears to have given up extra dollars to leave his club some wiggle room under the cap ceiling. Playing in Florida, which doesn’t have a state tax, also makes accepting $9.5 million annually a lot easier.
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